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Brexit discussion thread VII (Please read OP before posting)

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    #872
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,296 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    robinph wrote: »
    Just having a gander out of my office window now and it's about 50/50 of the cars going by that have the EU flag on them.

    It's more evidence of UK exceptionalism all the same

    Making such a thing optional


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    #873
    CelticRambler
    Registered Users Posts: 6,730 ✭✭✭CelticRambler


    There's a reply to that Tusk tweet that illustrates why Britain will probably go over the cliff:
    I voted to Remain in teh UK but you have to respect democracy and opinions. Yes, agree there was no plan but it is what it is."

    Between apathetic Remainers and Brexiteers who believe in the One True Unicorn, there's little chance now of the HoC signing off on any agreement by March 29th.


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    #874
    ArmaniJeanss
    Registered Users Posts: 13,326 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    Wow, that is some tweet from Tusk.

    The reaction from Express, JRM etc is going to be epic.

    Express has gone with....
    BREXIT LIVE: 'Special place in hell for Brexiteers' Tusk LOSES IT in vicious attack on UK


    Kinda surprised that Vicious or Attack weren't capitalised as well.
    I expect plenty of references to Passchendaele, gunboats and 'they don't like it up em' will be appearing in the comments.


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    #875
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users Posts: 7,264 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    ilovesmybrick wrote: »
    Tusk is certainly not mincing his words anymore

    Does that language help though? It will certainly play into the hands of the pro Brexit tabloids.

    Looks like game over for a new deal, if it was ever game on. I wonder how the markets will react tomorrow evening?


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    #876
    robinph
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,087 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    lawred2 wrote: »
    It's more evidence of UK exceptionalism all the same

    Making such a thing optional

    But the option is more down to the car dealer and the cost of buying blank plates than the person driving the car so don't read too much into it as far as the views of the population at large over having an EU flag on their number plate or not.


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    #877
    Oafley Jones
    Registered Users Posts: 6,465 ✭✭✭Oafley Jones


    People are getting hung up on the "Special place in hell" remark. The observation on a lack of opposition is more significant to my mind...


    But the facts are unmistakeable. At the moment the pro-Brexit stance of the UK prime minister, and the leader of the opposition, rules out this question.

    Today there is no political force, and no effective leadership, for remain.

    I say this without satisfaction, but you can’t argue with the facts.


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    #878
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,296 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    robinph wrote: »
    But the option is more down to the car dealer and the cost of buying blank plates than the person driving the car so don't read too much into it as far as the views of the population at large over having an EU flag on their number plate or not.

    oh sure but at an establishment level leaving that optional anywhere along the chain is exceptionalism..


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    #879
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    Wow, that is some tweet from Tusk.

    The reaction from Express, JRM etc is going to be epic.

    In the immortal words of Bullet Tooth Tony: "That's a bit strong innit?"


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    #880
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,296 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
    Express has gone with....
    BREXIT LIVE: 'Special place in hell for Brexiteers' Tusk LOSES IT in vicious attack on UK


    Kinda surprised that Vicious or Attack weren't capitalised as well.
    I expect plenty of references to Passchendaele, gunboats and 'they don't like it up em' will be appearing in the comments.

    we can expect a significant increased in war references over the next while


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    #881
    Tacitus Kilgore
    Registered Users Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭Tacitus Kilgore


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    Does that language help though? It will certainly play into the hands of the pro Brexit tabloids.

    Looks like game over for a new deal, if it was ever game on. I wonder how the markets will react tomorrow evening?

    Those tabloids are uk only, not EU wide though. Why should the EU pander to a soon-to-be ex members toxic press?


    The EU has held fast long enough to appease the British tabloids long enough, this whole suicide attempt by the UK is extremely damaging to the EU by no input of their own, and tongues have been held long enough. It seems now is the time to put the realities out there.

    Tusk obviously knows there's nothing but a hard brexit coming, so what difference does language make now?


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    #882
    robinph
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,087 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    Does that language help though? It will certainly play into the hands of the pro Brexit tabloids.

    Looks like game over for a new deal, if it was ever game on. I wonder how the markets will react tomorrow evening?

    Don't think there is any point in the EU playing nicely anymore. It's too late in the game and the UK are continuing to be idiots about it. It did make sense to give the air of neutrality as much as possible, but now it really doesn't matter. Just do a bit to make sure the message that the EU was being entirely reasonable and the UK were being f&*^wits gets out there for those few who are still paying attention.

    The pro brexit tabloids are not short of things to have a go at the EU over, a few extra things won't make any difference.


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    #883
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,044 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    The EU standing firm...
    https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1093112228964978688

    but oh dear...
    https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1093112119057354753


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    #884
    trellheim
    Registered Users Posts: 5,869 ✭✭✭trellheim


    we can expect a significant increased in war references over the next while

    Yes it looks like a war warning all right and by that I mean a hard no deal


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    #885
    WomanSkirtFan8
    Registered Users Posts: 768 ✭✭✭WomanSkirtFan8


    seamus wrote: »
    Yep, they're done playing the kid gloves game. They likely realised that the EU is getting blamed by the Brits one way or another, so they have no reason not to be blatantly honest about Brexit.

    They have also, again, made it clear that the deal is the deal:
    https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/0206/1027805-may_varadkar_brexit/


    ouch! That's some tweet from Tusk there. JRM and his fellow brexiteers are going to go absolutely ballistic with that. But what did they expect the EU to say.


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    #886
    Folkstonian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 421 ✭✭Folkstonian


    lawred2 wrote: »
    It's more evidence of UK exceptionalism all the same

    Making such a thing optional

    You are really reaching a bit here. Any opportunity to cry out about british ‘exceptionalism’ though, eh?

    Honestly, are you really resentful that some british cars do not have EU emblems on the registration plates? The European obsession for uniformity is offputting. I don’t think it’s a big deal - there is absolutely nothing in EU law that requires such emblems on a registration plate.


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    #887
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users Posts: 7,264 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    robinph wrote: »
    Don't think there is any point in the EU playing nicely anymore. It's too late in the game and the UK are continuing to be idiots about it. It did make sense to give the air of neutrality as much as possible, but now it really doesn't matter. Just do a bit to make sure the message that the EU was being entirely reasonable and the UK were being f&*^wits gets out there for those few who are still paying attention.

    The pro brexit tabloids are not short of things to have a go at the EU over, a few extra things won't make any difference.

    Eventually though a deal will have to be done, either before or after B-day. We stand as the nation most to lose after the UK from no deal. Megaphone diplomacy doesn't help.

    While truth speaking is always refreshing, for the right outcome this needs to come from within the UK not outside. This will just rile people, even if it's accurate.


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    #888
    demfad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    Bit cynical wrote: »
    I am prepared to support Ireland's strategy with respect to the backstop. What we have to accept though is that it is a strategy that may fail and, if it does, we can't blame the UK or other countries. It fails, imo, if it goes on year after year with no agreement, bearing in mind that we have the hard border during that time, the thing that we are supposedly against. Therefore, if it fails, I support the Government abandoning the strategy in those circumstances.

    May can secure a passage for a deal by simply softening her red lines. Or by agreeing to a mechanism to extend or revoke should time run out.
    She can do it today. She chooses not to because she chooses a hardline Brexit amongst all else.

    The attempt to threaten Ireland into removing the backstop is typical of this corrupt Government. We have good reason for keeping it.


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    #889
    Enzokk
    Registered Users Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Enzokk


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    The EU standing firm...
    https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1093112228964978688

    but oh dear...
    https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1093112119057354753

    'Breaking: Donald Tusk says the pro Brexit stance of the PM & leader of the opposition mean there is little hope of reversing the Brexit process'

    In case anyone was wondering, that sound you just heard was the glass shattering on the Corbyn illusion for many of his supporters. If the polls of Labour losing support if they facilitate Brexit in any way are correct, Tusk has thrown that hand grenade in there and you could see May coming out of this ahead in some inexplicable way.


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    #890
    demfad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    Eventually though a deal will have to be done, either before or after B-day. We stand as the nation most to lose after the UK from no deal. Megaphone diplomacy doesn't help.

    While truth speaking is always refreshing, for the right outcome this needs to come from within the UK not outside. This will just rile people, even if it's accurate.

    The reason people might get riled is that the UK is essentially a post truth country. The BBC reporting that Tusk thinks Brexteers should go to hell.

    Reality will catch up soon.

    THe Commons will take control.


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    #891
    Folkstonian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 421 ✭✭Folkstonian


    ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
    Express has gone with....
    BREXIT LIVE: 'Special place in hell for Brexiteers' Tusk LOSES IT in vicious attack on UK


    Kinda surprised that Vicious or Attack weren't capitalised as well.
    I expect plenty of references to Passchendaele, gunboats and 'they don't like it up em' will be appearing in the comments.

    Possibly, though I think it is important to acknowledge that this most recent escalation in the adversarial nature of the discourse is from your representative, not britain’s. It undermines the European belief that it conducts itself in a more composed and professional manner


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    #892
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,508 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    But when JRM claims the UK will be set into vassalage, or when Jeremy Hunt likened the EU to the USSR.

    And then you ad in all the numerous instances of MP's, both inside and outside the HoC, making inflammatory remarks about the EU, Ireland etc.

    I agree that the tweet does nobody any good, but one must realise the audience it is directed at. It is not the UK he is talking to but the EU, and it matches with the majority view.


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    #893
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,296 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Folkstonian wrote: »
    You are really reaching a bit here. Any opportunity to cry out about british ‘exceptionalism’ though, eh?

    Honestly, are you really resentful that some british cars do not have EU emblems on the registration plates? The European obsession for uniformity is offputting. I don’t think it’s a big deal - there is absolutely nothing in EU law that requires such emblems on a registration plate.

    nope - nor do I see it as a 'big deal'

    but simply more evidence of an unwillingness to fully embrace anything that would remotely be seen as 'European' - no matter how token..

    45 years of in but out at the same time has led us to where we are today


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    #894
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users Posts: 7,264 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Folkstonian wrote: »
    You are really reaching a bit here. Any opportunity to cry out about british ‘exceptionalism’ though, eh?

    Honestly, are you really resentful that some british cars do not have EU emblems on the registration plates? The European obsession for uniformity is offputting. I don’t think it’s a big deal - there is absolutely nothing in EU law that requires such emblems on a registration plate.

    Perhaps he is. You can't argue though that there was a reluctance in the UK to embrace the symbols of the EU. This even led to totally bizarre situations like the Metric Martyrs of all things. Where this reluctance to embrace the EU surely can considered a form of exceptionalism.

    But if you want to see real exceptionalism, you need only look at the "they need us more, than we need them" attitude. And that is pervasive.


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    #895
    Calina
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Calina


    Folkstonian wrote: »
    Possibly, though I think it is important to acknowledge that this most recent escalation in the adversarial nature of the discourse is from your representative, not britain’s. It undermines the European belief that it conducts itself in a more composed and professional manner

    Jeremy Hunt accused the EU of being lije the USSR. Tusk is mild by comparison and dealing in reality.

    in other words I do not agree with you.


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    #896
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,059 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    All those tweets from Tusk are just bluster. FAKE NEWS. Like the brexiters predict, the EU are gonna throw us under the bus and cave on the back stop any minute now.

    *Looks at watch*

    Yeah, any minute now. :pac:


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    #897
    josip
    Registered Users Posts: 13,692 ✭✭✭✭josip


    I does feel like a burden has been lifted somewhat with the acknowledgement that it will now be a no deal Brexit.
    At least we have some certainty about what will happen.
    The body language from Leo and Donald here is telling.

    https://twitter.com/yourmeps/status/1093119102279974918?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1093119719886995456&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fpolitics%2Flive%2F2019%2Ffeb%2F06%2Fbrexit-latest-news-developments-pmqs-theresa-may-faces-further-backlash-after-backstop-comments-in-belfast-speech-politics-live


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    #898
    Imreoir2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,435 ✭✭✭Imreoir2


    Just watched Tusk's speach, you could hear the little good natured exchange at the end between Leo and Tusk.

    Leo: "They will, am.. they will give you terrible trouble in the British Press for that one"

    Tusk: "Yes, I know".

    Leo: "By now you should".


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    #899
    J Mysterio
    Registered Users Posts: 11,035 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    I love how Tusk doubled down on the comment by saying it in the press conference and then also by tweet. LOL

    That's significant. Basically he is saying 'enough is enough'.


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    #900
    Tacitus Kilgore
    Registered Users Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭Tacitus Kilgore


    J Mysterio wrote: »
    I love how Tusk doubled down on the comment by saying it in the press conference and then also by tweet. LOL

    That's significant. Basically he is saying 'enough is enough'.

    Same,



    Kinda shit knowing a HB is guaranteed now,

    At the same time - nice to have a bit of certainty on something..


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    #901
    10000maniacs
    Registered Users Posts: 4,815 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    Imreoir2 wrote: »
    Just watched Tusk's speach, you could hear the little good natured exchange at the end between Leo and Tusk.

    Leo: "They will, am.. they will give you terrible trouble in the British Press for that one"

    Tusk: "Yes, I know".

    Leo: "By now you should".

    I thought it sounded more like
    "They will, am.. they will give you terrible trouble in the village"


This discussion has been closed.
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