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Physical Media Not Dead Says New HMV Owner.

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24

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    #32
    Bigmac1euro
    Registered Users Posts: 1,458 ✭✭✭Bigmac1euro


    Vinyl is the only way HMV might survive.
    Vinyl sales are doing extremely well at the moment so I’d say that’s this guys plan.
    Should be interesting to see. Vinyl is currently expensive and I know plenty of people buying old and new vinyl.


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    #33
    Gravelly
    Registered Users Posts: 4,119 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    steo_magra wrote: »
    Vinyl is the only way HMV might survive.
    Vinyl sales are doing extremely well at the moment so I’d say that’s this guys plan.
    Should be interesting to see. Vinyl is currently expensive and I know plenty of people buying old and new vinyl.

    The thing is though, it is very likely that the current trend for vinyl is just that - a trend. Although there will likely always be a market for it, I’d imagine that market will be minuscule once the current fashion for vinyl dies down - certainly there won’t be a large enough market to sustain a chain of high street stores.


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    #34
    9935452
    Registered Users Posts: 2,751 ✭✭✭9935452


    murpho999 wrote: »

    As for broadband, majority of people have access to good broadband now despite what many say. Currently have 360mb with Virgin and I'd guess in 5 years time that 10gb will be normal and that will most llikey kill off discs altogether.

    .

    What would you consider a good internet connection. ?
    Unless you live in a city or big town you will struggle .
    Im 2 miles outside a big town. My phone line wont support broadband.
    The parents are 3 miles on the other side of the town and have a 3mb connection.
    A friend a few miles out of a city had to get wireless bb cause there was nothing else. Paying 50 euro a month for 3mb at best.
    Another friend living inside a town is getting 9mb.
    I can go on and on.


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    #35
    mikhail
    Registered Users Posts: 3,863 ✭✭✭mikhail


    murpho999 wrote: »
    Why?
    What if the future digital was better quality then any physical media?

    Physical media can get lost or damaged. Digital can always be associated to your account and downloaded again.
    Until the vendor loses the rights to it and pulls it from your account.


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    #36
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    murpho999 wrote: »
    Oh yes The Sun, a fine quality journal.

    Sorry I just don't read that.

    The gist of it is that if itunes and the distributor do not renew their licensing agreement the movie will be deleted from your account.


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    #37
    murpho999
    Registered Users Posts: 28,436 ✭✭✭✭murpho999


    9935452 wrote: »
    What would you consider a good internet connection. ?
    Unless you live in a city or big town you will struggle .
    Im 2 miles outside a big town. My phone line wont support broadband.
    The parents are 3 miles on the other side of the town and have a 3mb connection.
    A friend a few miles out of a city had to get wireless bb cause there was nothing else. Paying 50 euro a month for 3mb at best.
    Another friend living inside a town is getting 9mb.
    I can go on and on.

    You're not giving any locations.

    Fact is the large urban centres where most people live have good broadband.

    I would consider receiving 100mb to be good.

    Majority of people around cities, which is where the majority of people in live, have access to this.


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    #38
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    murpho999 wrote: »
    Oh yes The Sun, a fine quality journal.

    Sorry I just don't read that.

    Liverpool fan?


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    #39
    Tipsy McSwagger
    Registered Users Posts: 9,065 ✭✭✭Tipsy McSwagger


    jh79 wrote: »
    Liverpool fan?

    Why does that matter? It’s a disgusting rag.


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    #40
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »
    Why does that matter? It’s a disgusting rag.

    Just curious, bit over the top for an article on itunes.


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    #41
    Technocentral
    Registered Users Posts: 6,101 ✭✭✭Technocentral


    Id go to a physical media store that had: New and used vinyl (not just top 10, back catalogues and wide range of genres) at good prices, good selection of blu rays not just mainstream, good coffee, good music and film books selections. They will never be mainstream again but a good off beat shop like this would get a large 35+ discerning clientele.


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    #42
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Technocentral wrote: »
    Id go to a physical media store that had: New and used vinyl (not just top 10) at good prices, good selection of blu rays not just mainstream, good coffee, good music and film books selections. They will never be mainstream again but a good off beat shop like this would get a 35+ discerning clientele.

    A cheaper version of Tower Records.


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    #43
    Gravelly
    Registered Users Posts: 4,119 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    Technocentral wrote: »
    Id go to a physical media store that had: New and used vinyl (not just top 10) at good prices, good selection of blu rays not just mainstream, good coffee, good music and film books selections. They will never be mainstream again but a good off beat shop like this would get a 35+ discerning clientele.

    A shop like that would probably do decent enough business in any large town or city, but would be extremely unlikely to make enough to justify the prime retail spots (with the associated rent & rates) that HMV stores occupy.
    All the vinyl stores I'm aware of are sidestreet operations.


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    #44
    Technocentral
    Registered Users Posts: 6,101 ✭✭✭Technocentral


    jh79 wrote: »
    Technocentral wrote: »
    Id go to a physical media store that had: New and used vinyl (not just top 10) at good prices, good selection of blu rays not just mainstream, good coffee, good music and film books selections. They will never be mainstream again but a good off beat shop like this would get a 35+ discerning clientele.

    A cheaper version of Tower Records.

    Yeah they are still good but the Dawson St one was great when they had that cafe upstairs, I used to go for lunch then browse the vinyl/blu ray sections, was always pretty full, wonder why they closed.


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    #45
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    murpho999 wrote: »
    You're not giving any locations.

    Fact is the large urban centres where most people live have good broadband.

    I would consider receiving 100mb to be good.

    Majority of people around cities, which is where the majority of people in live, have access to this.

    Cork city, for my parents. INSIDE the city boundary in a very well established residential area


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    #46
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,992 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    I don't think physical media is dead, but I think the HMV model is more or less dead.

    I still buy Blu-Rays frequently - if anything, the medium has only become more vital as companies like Arrow, Criterion, Masters of Cinema etc... continue to dig deep into cinema history and release loving, generous restorations of all kinds of classics. From obscure B-Movies or neglected arthouse oddities to insanely lavish collections dedicated to the world's best filmmakers, none of the streaming platforms come close to offering the variety and quality you can find in physical media releases. Long may it continue, as far as I'm concerned - it's genuinely helped me towards a far broader understanding of film history than I'd otherwise have managed.

    Equally, I'm aware the above is a niche market - and the companies that survive (and in some cases thrive) have evolved to focus on a small but hopefully sustainable group of collectors and cinephiles. I'm not sure the HMV model fits with that - I'd imagine the vast amount of purchasing is done online. While I'd hate to see physical media stores disappearing - there's still something satisfying about browsing Tower Records, the IFI bookshop, or Fopp and the BFI store in the UK - I buy most things online and directly from the distributors involved when I can. The situation is more dire from the more ‘high street’ chains than the small, independent vinyl stores and the like (some of which will likely continue to have modest success).

    So no, physical media isn't dead - but HMV will almost certainly remain on life support until the plug is eventually pulled.

    Agreed.

    Physical media may not be dead, but how the consumer buys it is changing.

    Like you, I like the act of browsing and deciding on a purchase in a real life shop. That kind of hunt is a lot more satisfying than clicking a button on a browser and going to an online checkout.

    But, more and more, I find myself just getting a Blu online while I'm browsing.


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    #47
    murpho999
    Registered Users Posts: 28,436 ✭✭✭✭murpho999


    jh79 wrote: »
    Liverpool fan?

    Yes, that's a big reason but I woudn't go near it for anything.


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    #48
    murpho999
    Registered Users Posts: 28,436 ✭✭✭✭murpho999


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Cork city, for my parents. INSIDE the city boundary in a very well established residential area

    Of course there are exceptions, I did say MOST people.


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    #49
    Fysh
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 11,019 Mod ✭✭✭✭Fysh


    An example of the downsides of digital media in the context of current business trends like non-perpetual licences for music. Another one. And another (previously owned by Tesco). And another one, this one an industry-wide effort.

    So between the potential for "special edition"ised versions of films becoming the only ones available, and the potential for your library to vanish if the service shuts down (and the ubiquity of DRM requiring serverside authentication for playback), there's not really any service where you can say with certainty that if you pay for access, you'll get it indefinitely.

    I am grateful that streaming has significantly broadened my access to films and music I might not otherwise find, but the business paradigms under which most streaming services operate mean that they are not great for creators, and good for audiences only in so much as you'll always have access to something - but if you want access to a specific thing, currently physical media is the most reliable way. At least there you've got a physical copy you can play and, where possible, rip to a digital file to work around hardware obsolescence.

    Of course, the above is based on what I want from my film purchases. Others may want different things and find different terms and services suit them better, which is fair enough :)


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    #50
    BuffaloTengo
    Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭BuffaloTengo


    Having the ability to walk into a shop and purchase a blu ray film as opposed to having to subscribe to 5 or 6 streaming sites just to get the one film you want.
    No question for me, I'll always support physical media - preferably bought in bricks and mortar shops.


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    #51
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Fysh wrote: »
    An example of the downsides of digital media in the context of current business trends like non-perpetual licences for music. Another one. And another (previously owned by Tesco). And another one, this one an industry-wide effort.

    So between the potential for "special edition"ised versions of films becoming the only ones available, and the potential for your library to vanish if the service shuts down (and the ubiquity of DRM requiring serverside authentication for playback), there's not really any service where you can say with certainty that if you pay for access, you'll get it indefinitely.

    Books are another one: I did recently get a kindle admittedly, but I still buy physical books & reserve the kindle for traveling & picking up... well, the modern equivalent of penny dreadfuls. Nothing I'd have been mad keen to read anyway.

    The idea that the oldest form of media out there - the printed word - is now also in the cloud and basically strangled by non-perpetually leasing to the end user feels borderline obscene. I doubt Gutenberg himself would be able to get that concept round his head. A book on a shelf is a classic, almost timeless concept and that physicality and sense of ownership of a piece of art or entertainment is impossible to replicate by a digital service (but like I said, do appreciate the benefits of the kindle)


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    #52
    branie2
    Registered Users Posts: 10,298 ✭✭✭✭branie2


    He's right; I buy a lot of film on Blu-ray.


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    #53
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    murpho999 wrote: »
    Of course there are exceptions, I did say MOST people.

    Exceptions are a house or two. Entire suburbs are another. It's half the northside of the city!


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    #54
    murpho999
    Registered Users Posts: 28,436 ✭✭✭✭murpho999


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Exceptions are a house or two. Entire suburbs are another. It's half the northside of the city!

    I prefer facts than anecdotal evidence.

    Broadband Supply Map


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    #55
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    murpho999 wrote: »
    I prefer facts than anecdotal evidence.

    Broadband Supply Map

    That map has my address as complete for high speed
    I have 10Mb

    It has my parents estate covered.
    They get 20Mb

    My aunt lives 400 metres away. Same result and all houses between several estates are the same.

    A house I was in, temporarily, while I was waiting for renovations on my own house, is another 300 metres away. Same result.


    So I will take my (although small) sample size, versus a map which fails on several examinations


    Otherwise we must have been exceptionally unlucky.

    We all have "broadband" but nothing which will managed 4K streaming


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    #56
    Gravelly
    Registered Users Posts: 4,119 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    Deleted User wrote: »
    That map has my address as complete for high speed
    I have 10Mb

    It has my parents estate covered.
    They get 20Mb

    My aunt lives 400 metres away. Same result and all houses between several estates are the same.

    A house I was in, temporarily, while I was waiting for renovations on my own house, is another 300 metres away. Same result.


    So I will take my (although small) sample size, versus a map which fails on several examinations


    Otherwise we must have been exceptionally unlucky.

    We all have "broadband" but nothing which will managed 4K streaming

    It's very optimistic about my place too!


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    #57
    OwaynOTT
    Registered Users Posts: 10,540 ✭✭✭✭OwaynOTT


    Those maps are always a load of bollix and that's from someone who worked with them for years.


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    #58
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    OwaynOTT wrote: »
    Those maps are always a load of bollix and that's from someone who worked with them for years.




    Oh I know


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    #59
    Sleeper12
    Registered Users Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    Deleted User wrote:
    He is right though. You do not own the media, only the access rights to it on that platform.

    Totally correct
    I think I remember someone famous, American movie star or something, talking about bringing iTunes to court 6 or 7 years ago. He was horrified to discover that his whole iTunes collection dies with him. He couldn't leave it to his children on his death.


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    #60
    n!ghtmancometh
    Registered Users Posts: 407 ✭✭n!ghtmancometh


    pixelburp wrote: »
    Books are another one: I did recently get a kindle admittedly, but I still buy physical books & reserve the kindle for traveling & picking up... well, the modern equivalent of penny dreadfuls. Nothing I'd have been mad keen to read anyway.

    The idea that the oldest form of media out there - the printed word - is now also in the cloud and basically strangled by non-perpetually leasing to the end user feels borderline obscene. I doubt Gutenberg himself would be able to get that concept round his head. A book on a shelf is a classic, almost timeless concept and that physicality and sense of ownership of a piece of art or entertainment is impossible to replicate by a digital service (but like I said, do appreciate the benefits of the kindle)

    I have a nook e-reader that I bought about 8 years ago still going strong, that I use for travelling and commuting reading. The books I own on that device are not stored in the cloud, but on the device local memory or SD cards. I still buy physical books (mainly second hand) from the wonderful Chapters and a few other book shops.

    I still love the look of books on a shelf. I can't say the same thing about plastic DVD/Blu Ray boxes or CD cases cluttering up the place. Will always be a market for physical books, but I think once most homes have access to usable broadband services, demand for physical copies of movies and music will drop even more than it has.


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    #61
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    n!ghtmancometh wrote: »
    I have a nook e-reader that I bought about 8 years ago still going strong, that I use for travelling and commuting reading. The books I own on that device are not stored in the cloud, but on the device local memory or SD cards. I still buy physical books (mainly second hand) from the wonderful Chapters and a few other book shops.

    I still love the look of books on a shelf. I can't say the same thing about plastic DVD/Blu Ray boxes or CD cases cluttering up the place. Will always be a market for physical books, but I think once most homes have access to usable broadband services, demand for physical copies of movies and music will drop even more than it has.






    Ah but this is a key difference. You own the files, you can transfer them to your other devices or to several backups.


    You do not own the movie files. It's very hard to legally get a copy of the digital files (never mind the high quality versions on the disc). You can not put them on several devices for backup, or share them across devices, without having an internet connection to the service.


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