Rents to rise to 2500 a month in Dublin

Samuel T. Cogley · 14-02-2018 9:41pm

Mickiemcfist wrote: »

I've never seen any data showing us as inside the top 20 for land prices, where did you see that?

I'm all for building up in select areas, from custom house down to the port & all around silicon docks etc. It doesn't make financial sense to do so, but I'm all for anyone who's willing to build up, Johnny Ronan is currently attempting it at Tara st & I actually like the proposed building. Urban sprawl has to be worse for the environment than denser cities *I have nothing specific backing up that opinion, just gut feel

Not Land prices, expense of living. Rent being a massive factor.

daheff · 14-02-2018 11:02pm

jay0109 wrote: »

And 550 new jobs in 2 announcements for Dublin today. Carnage

New jobs does not necessarily equal more people moving to Dublin. Might just be a shift around or people.

In any case the Auto desk jobs were on the market a while back (& prob already filled) mid aren't for a while yet.... If at all.

fritzelly · 15-02-2018 12:16am

Elessar wrote: »

They expect the trend to continue until at least €2500 a month before the market starts to normalise.

Normalise? Jaysus is all I've got to say - getting ridiculous. That's double the average mortgage payments on a house in Dublin

Assetbacked · 15-02-2018 12:33am

fritzelly wrote: »

Normalise? Jaysus is all I've got to say - getting ridiculous. That's double the average mortgage payments on a house in Dublin

Normalize used in that context is scary. So prices now will be seen as normal if they drop back to the levels they are now? Or what would t mean?

It’s funny that there are stories of the economy being so strong but with so much of young people’s salaries taken up with rent, the feeling of a booming economy doesn’t exist. I have a decently paid job but after rent I don’t have a lot left to save and cover living expenses.

As a previous poster alluded to, the economic system is broken and people are distracted from this with their smart phones and Netflix. The system is rigged to allow the rich get richer and the wealth get concentrated in fewer and fewer hands. I hope there is a significant world event which will destabilise the entire economic system and allow ordinary people to unite against the common enemy which is the disgusting economic system. No individual should be allowed acquire millions of euro, it’s disgraceful.

For Dublin, all the offices being built and flooding the market resulting in an idiotic imbalamce of office space as against apartments for the employees, will lead to companies not setting up here and existing companies no longer expanding. The bubble will burst and the populist parties will get their votes at the next election which will create its own political chaos. And this will be welcomed as it should be across the world. Let us have chaos.

DaveyDave · 15-02-2018 12:54am

I'm going back home after 8 months in a basic, small, cold and damp 2 bed apartment. €1,450 a month. It's up for €1,550 now. 28% of my net salary and nothing to show for it. No dishwasher, no electric shower, heating barely worked, no driveway etc. Had a look at what's to rent in the area at the moment and a lot of properties are €2,000+

Plenty of houses to buy though, that's the funny thing. A mortgage would cost us €1,050ish. Should have a deposit by the end of the year.

Can someone explain the rise for me? What difference does it make to a landlord that's there's nothing to rent on the market? How does that justify properties that are worth €1,000-1,200 going up to €1,600-2,000? I can't imagine it makes any difference to the property they're renting?

fritzelly · 15-02-2018 1:38am

DaveyDave wrote: »

I'm going back home after 8 months in a basic, small, cold and damp 2 bed apartment. €1,450 a month. It's up for €1,550 now. 28% of my net salary and nothing to show for it. No dishwasher, no electric shower, heating barely worked, no driveway etc. Had a look at what's to rent in the area at the moment and a lot of properties are €2,000+

Plenty of houses to buy though, that's the funny thing. A mortgage would cost us €1,050ish. Should have a deposit by the end of the year.

Can someone explain the rise for me? What difference does it make to a landlord that's there's nothing to rent on the market? How does that justify properties that are worth €1,000-1,200 going up to €1,600-2,000? I can't imagine it makes any difference to the property they're renting?

Nothing to justify bar how much can we milk this for. Rent controls severely needed

Bob24 · 15-02-2018 6:07am

fritzelly wrote: »

Nothing to justify bar how much can we milk this for. Rent controls severely needed

Rent control doesn't really work and hurts everyone in the end. What's needed is more supply to for prices down.

daheff · 15-02-2018 6:14am

Bob24 wrote: »

Rent control doesn't really work and hurts everyone in the end. What's needed is more supply to for prices down.

But to get supply the builder has to get his cut.... So sales prices are high..... Which means rental price goes up.... So investor gets a return.... It's all linked

Too much supply & builder can't sell at a profit... So won't.

Bob24 · 15-02-2018 6:20am

daheff wrote: »

But to get supply the builder has to get his cut.... So sales prices are high..... Which means rental price goes up.... So investor gets a return.... It's all linked

Too much supply & builder can't sell at a profit... So won't.

Builders can do it at reasonable prices in other countries. We need to understand what's wrong here and address it.

Potentially this could be things liked to (in no particular order, and not saying all of these apply - just ideas to explore):
- Lending cost too high for builders and eating up their margins
- Builders are inefficient
- Taxation linked to new builds is too high
- Regulation increases cost too much
- Labour cost is too high in the industry
- Competition is too low / Builders are too greedy

NIMAN · 15-02-2018 6:36am

Dublin is turning into a right basket case.

Between bubbling house prices and rents, and I just did a search for a Saturday night in July for a concert and the cheapest hotel room is €250, and the AirBnB prices are much cheaper. Looks like that concerts cancelled so.

Think what I mean is its a dear hole!

murphaph · 15-02-2018 6:50am

DaveyDave wrote: »

I'm going back home after 8 months in a basic, small, cold and damp 2 bed apartment. €1,450 a month. It's up for €1,550 now. 28% of my net salary and nothing to show for it. No dishwasher, no electric shower, heating barely worked, no driveway etc. Had a look at what's to rent in the area at the moment and a lot of properties are €2,000+

Plenty of houses to buy though, that's the funny thing. A mortgage would cost us €1,050ish. Should have a deposit by the end of the year.

Can someone explain the rise for me? What difference does it make to a landlord that's there's nothing to rent on the market? How does that justify properties that are worth €1,000-1,200 going up to €1,600-2,000? I can't imagine it makes any difference to the property they're renting?

It's what justified the massive rent decreases around 2008-2009. Why were tenants asking for massive rent reductions? It was a tenant's market then as there was a glut in supply. My property went from 1300 down to 875 in the space of a year. Couldn't rent it for more than that.

When the sun shines the landlord needs to make hay because the next downturn may come anytime.

Samuel T. Cogley · 15-02-2018 7:55am

DaveyDave wrote: »

I'm going back home after 8 months in a basic, small, cold and damp 2 bed apartment. €1,450 a month. It's up for €1,550 now. 28% of my net salary and nothing to show for it. No dishwasher, no electric shower, heating barely worked, no driveway etc. Had a look at what's to rent in the area at the moment and a lot of properties are €2,000+

Plenty of houses to buy though, that's the funny thing. A mortgage would cost us €1,050ish. Should have a deposit by the end of the year.

Can someone explain the rise for me? What difference does it make to a landlord that's there's nothing to rent on the market? How does that justify properties that are worth €1,000-1,200 going up to €1,600-2,000? I can't imagine it makes any difference to the property they're renting?

LL's are generally on a negative cash flow (any profit goes towards capital repayment), it's only now that there has been the opportunity to push cash flow in to the positive. It's a business at the end of the day. As for a difference it shouldn't make any difference but in reality people aren't going to spend money upgrading unless they have it.

Jucifer · 15-02-2018 7:55am

It’s funny the talk in recent years that we should all get used to long term renting rather than home ownership. All the current housing market is doing is pushing young people towards home ownership due to the imbalance between mortgage rates and rent.

My wife and I are close to having a deposit scrounged together and we won’t be looking back.

On a separate note I think development of regional cities such as Cork Limerick and Galway is a necessity. However these cities also have serious price pressures in the housing and rental markets based on the double digit annual price increases quoted in recent reports. A focus needs to be placed on creating supply in a smart targeted approach, with strengthened public transport and services. Unfortunately long term vision is lacking at local and national government levels.

Edit: I may have a bias towards regional development as I am currently on one of my 3x per week 3.25 hour door to door each way commutes to Dublin for work.

Samuel T. Cogley · 15-02-2018 8:43am

Jucifer wrote: »

It’s funny the talk in recent years that we should all get used to long term renting rather than home ownership.

Not sure that's been the case tbh.

The issue many have here is the culture isn't to start saving in your early twenties and rough it in shared accommodation and then buy like it is in parts of the UK; any savings go into going abroad and why shouldn't it. Once you're out renting an apartment you're screwed - my advice to anyone is stay at home and wait until you can buy, you'll be better off in the longer term. Although that advice is beginning to become difficult to give as apartments take off and the bubble gets bigger.

Jucifer · 15-02-2018 9:27am

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Once you're out renting an apartment you're screwed - my advice to anyone is stay at home and wait until you can buy, you'll be better off in the longer term. Although that advice is beginning to become difficult to give as apartments take off and the bubble gets bigger.

Yes that is probably a sensible solution but as you said, when young many want to go out and experience freedom of living away from home and traveling. But there are repercussions of those choices such as being in mid thirties and hoping you can buy a home before house prices rise too much more (my own situation).

CalRobert · 15-02-2018 9:27am

CruelCoin wrote: »

For that money you could pay the mortgage on !!!3!!! x 4-beds where i live, an hour from Dublin.

Christ, is saving 2 hours a day in the car worth the difference?

For a lot of people who are already in Dublin what you propose also means getting a licence, getting a car, paying insurance, finding parking, etc. etc.

For me, at least, cheaper rent + car ownership would still cost more than high rent in the city, and this way I get an extra two hours a day with my kid.

Samuel T. Cogley · 15-02-2018 9:34am

CalRobert wrote: »

For a lot of people who are already in Dublin what you propose also means getting a licence, getting a car, paying insurance, finding parking, etc. etc.

For me, at least, cheaper rent + car ownership would still cost more than high rent in the city, and this way I get an extra two hours a day with my kid.

I'm in a cheaper area in Dublin and am across the city in 20 minutes to work. Bugger a 2 hour commute no matter how good the cow pats smell. :pac:

CalRobert · 15-02-2018 9:39am

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

I'm in a cheaper area in Dublin and am across the city in 20 minutes to work. Bugger a 2 hour commute no matter how good the cow pats smell. :pac:

Seriously. But to each their own. I used to work in a place I hated (sprawling suburbia) and did a 45 minute train + 15 minute bike ride each way to live in the city. It got pretty old, though, and the train/cycling are far nicer than driving (to me at least).

Either way, though, that's two hours of life each day you won't get back.

For all that, the rent stings and I recently had a house fall through in an area I like (Liberties) and part of me wants to just buy a house cash way, way out somewhere and try my hand at homesteading.

c.p.w.g.w · 15-02-2018 10:01am

NIMAN wrote: »

Dublin is turning into a right basket case.

Between bubbling house prices and rents, and I just did a search for a Saturday night in July for a concert and the cheapest hotel room is €250, and the AirBnB prices are much cheaper. Looks like that concerts cancelled so.

Think what I mean is its a dear hole!

The OH is going to a gig on the Saturday of the Easter Bank Holiday weekend with family.

So myself and herself said we'd look at staying the Sunday & Monday Night...No way to expensive, so we booked flights, hotel & taxi(to hotel from airport) for 3 days in Paris for the same price as 2 night stays in Dublin.

polydactyl · 15-02-2018 10:04am

Am in process of trying to buy a house and will need to rent out my apt as it’s still in neg equity although barely. It’s a really warm, well decorated 2 bed plus study and I love it but It’s absolutely ridiculous that a neg equity apt was barely glanced at in terms of our new mortgage application as they knew it would rent above the mortgage (although despite being in a walkable to o Connell st suburb it won’t go for 2000) And yes tax etc etc will still leave me at a loss each month but I find it ridiculous how they looked positively almost on it (although obv I am thrilled as I want the new house but have saved every penny for a deposit)

Samuel T. Cogley · 15-02-2018 10:07am

polydactyl wrote: »

Am in process of trying to buy a house and will need to rent out my apt as it’s still in neg equity although barely. It’s a really warm, well decorated 2 bed plus study and I love it but It’s absolutely ridiculous that a neg equity apt was barely glanced at in terms of our new mortgage application as they knew it would rent above the mortgage (although despite being in a walkable to o Connell st suburb it won’t go for 2000) And yes tax etc etc will still leave me at a loss each month but I find it ridiculous how they looked positively almost on it (although obv I am thrilled as I want the new house but have saved every penny for a deposit)

As people are (rightly) fond of pointing out to me you won't be at a loss, your profit is merely going into capital repayments and your cash flow is (slightly)negative.

Jucifer · 15-02-2018 10:08am

CalRobert wrote: »

For a lot of people who are already in Dublin what you propose also means getting a licence, getting a car, paying insurance, finding parking, etc. etc.

For me, at least, cheaper rent + car ownership would still cost more than high rent in the city, and this way I get an extra two hours a day with my kid.

I would have to agree although at the moment I travel from the other side of the country a few days per week I.e 6.5 hours round trip on public transport. In long term if have kids 2 hour round trip would be just about acceptable. When I did live in Dublin an hour each way to and from work was pretty standard though. So even in Dublin many face significant commutes if they want affordable mortgage/rent.

15-02-2018 10:22am

Bob24 wrote: »

Builders can do it at reasonable prices in other countries. We need to understand what's wrong here and address it.

Potentially this could be things liked to (in no particular order, and not saying all of these apply - just ideas to explore):
- Lending cost too high for builders and eating up their margins
- Builders are inefficient
- Taxation linked to new builds is too high
- Regulation increases cost too much
- Labour cost is too high in the industry
- Competition is too low / Builders are too greedy

I keep asking this, how is building so expensive here? I've been in 200k houses in the Netherlands in a city with higher average income than Dublin and the standard of finish and insulation etc. is much higher than just about anything I've come across in Ireland. How is that?

strandsman · 15-02-2018 11:20am

awec wrote: »

Why on earth would anyone who goes to the effort of getting professional qualifications go and work in a shop to live in the likes of Cashel? That is mental.

Most young IT professionals want careers, they want the hustle and bustle of city life, they want to be around like-minded people. While money in your pocket is important it is not the only factor, I am sure they could go and get some more money in their pocket every month but at the expense of being bored off their head with their job and their life.

Maybe there are some industries that would be suited to being moved to other population centres other than Dublin, but IT will always be heavily concentrated in Dublin.

So it's not mental to live in Dub for high rent, high property purchase, expensive living, crime, overcrowding.

strandsman · 15-02-2018 11:27am

Grayson wrote: »

It would also mean not living in Dublin.

I'm a single guy. If I was to move to cashel what exactly would I be doing there? If I was married it would be one thing but as a single person I'd be moving to the middle of nowhere. I'd have no friends around. The chances of meeting someone there decreases. There's no reason for me to move there except to pay less rent. And that's not worth it if I have an empty life.

You'd have no friends around? Fine stay in dub so and just put up with the misery of living there.

o1s1n · 15-02-2018 11:29am

CalRobert wrote: »

For a lot of people who are already in Dublin what you propose also means getting a licence, getting a car, paying insurance, finding parking, etc. etc.

For me, at least, cheaper rent + car ownership would still cost more than high rent in the city, and this way I get an extra two hours a day with my kid.

I've done the whole 'get a mortgage and move to the suburbs' thing after spending years in the city centre and I just found it so utterly boring. Space was great, but I like being in the city centre and travelling back and forth (this was only out to Bray, mind you) was driving me mad. I'd probably lose my mind living any further out.

Sold up, bought a place in the city and much happier now

Mind you, if things were different and I had to pay the current rental sums it might change my outlook somewhat..!

Bob24 · 15-02-2018 11:37am

strandsman wrote: »

So it's not mental to live in Dub for high rent, high property purchase, expensive living, crime, overcrowding.

Better schools, better hospitals, better transportation links, more cultural events.

It’s the same in every country, bigs cities are more stressful and expensive, but overall offer more oportunities and services. No one is mental with their choice of where to live, it is just a matter of personal constraints/priorities. I had the exact same discussion with a Chinese person last week about people chooseing between a career in Beijing/Shanghai or in their native smaller city.

(And to be clear I’m not saying you can’t be successfull/happy in the country, but clearly while you might gain some things you are sacrificing others).

Mickiemcfist · 15-02-2018 1:40pm

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Not Land prices, expense of living. Rent being a massive factor.

Expense of living & rent have zero impact on a construction company deciding to build upwards though

Samuel T. Cogley · 15-02-2018 2:09pm

Mickiemcfist wrote: »

Expense of living & rent have zero impact on a construction company deciding to build upwards though

It does to those renting, through increased supply, which was my point.

LirW · 15-02-2018 2:12pm

Mickiemcfist wrote: »

Expense of living & rent have zero impact on a construction company deciding to build upwards though

It has an impact on supply though when everything gets objected by locals, which I think is a huge problem. Can't stand this ridiculous NIMBYism where people object 3 or 4 storey buildings. At some point you need to draw the line, do you wanna attract people to Dublin or do you wanna be a planning embarrassment because Joe and Mary are worried about their view on their neighbours roof?

Rents to rise to 2500 a month in Dublin

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