Now ye're talking - to a professional photographer

davedanon · 09-11-2018 12:34am

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA wrote: »

We do seem to be a rare breed. Almost everyone I know shoots Nikon.

Funny, I'd have thought the complete opposite. The Irish (and international) press corps are overwhelmingly Canon-dominated.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 09-11-2018 4:07am

davedanon wrote: »

Funny, I'd have thought the complete opposite. The Irish (and international) press corps are overwhelmingly Canon-dominated.

They may well be the dominant brand alright. When I'm on a job I rarely ever look at what anyone else is using. Unless it's obvious (like a white Canon lens) I'm generally unaware.

Of the photographers I know personally, Nikon certainly rules the roost.

RabbleRouser2k · 09-11-2018 5:45am

With regards to photographing people and nude modelling, do you have to bring in a makeup artist or stylist on these kinds of shoots?

And in relation to some of the jobs you describe, have you ever turned down a job? I know you mentioned photographing a stillborn child for one couple (much respect and admiration to you for doing so-I can't imagine how difficult that situation was for the parents, in that you provided them with evidence of their only child). But have you ever had someone try and hire you for a job you distinctly felt was in poor taste, or not to your liking?

Effects · 09-11-2018 5:48am

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

you provided them with evidence of their only child

It's not evidence of a child. It's a photograph of a memory.

RabbleRouser2k · 09-11-2018 5:50am

Effects wrote: »

It's not evidence of a child. It's a photograph of a memory.

Yeah, apologies for that-tried to word it right and then worded it all wrong.

Effects · 09-11-2018 6:00am

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Yeah, apologies for that-tried to word it right and then worded it all wrong.

No problem. I've been through it so just took it a bit personally.

RabbleRouser2k · 09-11-2018 7:09am

Effects wrote: »

No problem. I've been through it so just took it a bit personally.

Yeah-I can understand that. No malice intended on my part. I'd amend the original post, but I think it would be a disservice to both of us to do so.

Just noting there was no malice intended on my part-I just flunked on the wording.

LimeFruitGum · 09-11-2018 8:11pm

To follow from your example about a gym recycling pics for a campaign. What’s your opinion/advice on newspapers lifting pics from somebody’s social media? I have seen some tweets where someone refused the Daily Mail permission to use their photo, but the paper published it anyway.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 10-11-2018 1:35am

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

With regards to photographing people and nude modelling, do you have to bring in a makeup artist or stylist on these kinds of shoots?

It can very much depend on what the photos are for. If someone contacts me and wants to book a session, I will always give the option of a makeup artist or hairdresser. Very rarely would it be taken up, though.

Very few of my portrait shoots (nude or not) have had make-up or hair done professionally (in many cases the girls will have gotten their hair done by their regular hairdresser, but nothing special or specific for, or during, the shoot itself).

I did team up with a makeup studio before and we offered a valentines package, but it didn't sell too well. I knew it wouldn't though. They included silly amounts of stuff (tried to make it into an event; hair, makeup, champagne, sexy photos, limo to take you from the photo session to a local club, with X amount of free drinks, etc.) so it ended up costing a fortune. Was a real 'celtic tiger' idea, but it was being pitched at the lowest curve of the recession. The minute I heard what it entailed, I rolled my eyes and knew I'd never see that limo (and I never did).

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

And in relation to some of the jobs you describe, have you ever turned down a job? I know you mentioned photographing a stillborn child for one couple (much respect and admiration to you for doing so-I can't imagine how difficult that situation was for the parents, in that you provided them with evidence of their only child). But have you ever had someone try and hire you for a job you distinctly felt was in poor taste, or not to your liking?

I might come back to this question. I'm sure there have been, but nothing specifically is springing to mind. A lot of jobs I do, even if I reckon they might be a tad questionable, I'd be very much of the opinion that if I'm not doing it, someone else will be, so I might aswell be the one that pockets the few Euro for doing it.

For example, I've stood at the roadside, photographing a fatal car accident. The body was being removed from the car and into the ambulance. I'd a clear shot of the person being taken from the car. I deliberately missed it, and instead snapped more generic imagery. On one hand, you could argue that this is someone's dying moments and it's completely disrespectful to turn it into a media circus. On the other hand, I wasn't the only one standing there, and if I wasn't the one taking the photos someone else would have them into the paper the next day, anyway.

So you can take miniature moral victories, but at the end of the day, I still took the photos and sold them. Many people would call me a scumbag, but the same people would buy the paper that has those photos on the cover.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 10-11-2018 1:48am

LimeFruitGum wrote: »

To follow from your example about a gym recycling pics for a campaign. What’s your opinion/advice on newspapers lifting pics from somebody’s social media? I have seen some tweets where someone refused the Daily Mail permission to use their photo, but the paper published it anyway.

I don't really know how up to date my knowledge is in regards to this. So take my advice with the grain of salt it so truly deserves. Also keep in mind, I can't give legal advice on Boards (nor would I be qualified to).

From what I recall, Facebook terms stated that anything you uploaded to their platform became their material and it was allowed to be used any which way anyone wanted to (effectively, became a public image, with you accepting, by uploading to facebook, that Facebook took the copyright).

I think this was challenged (not necessarily in court, but by the user base in general) and I believe that Facebook rescinded and took the stance that although you allow Facebook permission to use your images, likenesses, etc. the uploader/creator of the content maintains copyright of the image.

I've not actually sat down and read through the terms and conditions of Facebook properly (I'm assuming the newspaper editors have), but my understanding is that it's a bit of a grey area, although if you have taken a photo, and permission has been sought to use it, and you decline, but it was used anyway, I'd imagine you have a case for chasing them for payment (payment could include a hefty fee for improper use, to make it worthwhile pursuing).

In your specific story, I would imagine that whoever took the photograph retains copyright, and the newspaper have demonstrated that they are aware of this (why would they ask for permission, otherwise?). If they never asked, they could possibly claim ignorance, but asking has put them in a bit of a hole, possibly.

But again, I can't stress enough just how out of the loop I am with regards to who can use Facebook photos. I see them used the whole time, all over the media, from TV broadcast to Print, so I am presuming they're allowed to do it (or they'd all be getting invoiced left, right and centre, and there'd be ads on the radio saying "did the news use your photo? You could be due compensation" and so forth, but I can't say for sure.

I realise this is a bit of a nonsense 'sitting on the fence' post from me, but I really can't advise one way or the other as I simply don't know the factual answer.

Darren 83 · 10-11-2018 8:47am

Have you ever been challenged about taking photos in public from parents? While I was never challenged I got some dirty looks from people while shooting running road races.

The J Stands for Jay · 10-11-2018 10:11am

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA wrote: »

I don't really know how up to date my knowledge is in regards to this. So take my advice with the grain of salt it so truly deserves. Also keep in mind, I can't give legal advice on Boards (nor would I be qualified to).

From what I recall, Facebook terms stated that anything you uploaded to their platform became their material and it was allowed to be used any which way anyone wanted to (effectively, became a public image, with you accepting, by uploading to facebook, that Facebook took the copyright).

I think this was challenged (not necessarily in court, but by the user base in general) and I believe that Facebook rescinded and took the stance that although you allow Facebook permission to use your images, likenesses, etc. the uploader/creator of the content maintains copyright of the image.

I've not actually sat down and read through the terms and conditions of Facebook properly (I'm assuming the newspaper editors have), but my understanding is that it's a bit of a grey area, although if you have taken a photo, and permission has been sought to use it, and you decline, but it was used anyway, I'd imagine you have a case for chasing them for payment (payment could include a hefty fee for improper use, to make it worthwhile pursuing).

It always annoys me when I read or watch news reports about someone who's died or been injured and they use their Facebook picture. So much so that I idly think about putting it in my will that my estate should persue any news outlets that use my pictures if I die in a newsworthy manner.

The J Stands for Jay · 10-11-2018 10:15am

Do you visit photography forum online like boards or Reddit? Do you use Flickr and/or Instagram? (Not looking for links, just wondering if a pro bothers with these).

A lot of online photography websites just focus on gear, but you seem to be pretty settled on your kit.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 10-11-2018 5:40pm

Darren 83 wrote: »

Have you ever been challenged about taking photos in public from parents? While I was never challenged I got some dirty looks from people while shooting running road races.

I've heard of people calling the Gardai on people taking photos of their kids, but I've never actually seen it happen, or heard of it happening to anyone I know personally.

Perhaps it's because I'm a photographer, but I expect people to be aware that any road race or public event will likely have photographers attending.

You might perhaps get approached if you look like you're trying to hide what you're doing, but during a children's road race, I'd be standing in front of them in the middle of the road at the start line and would have a big DSLR, a camera bag, etc. so I'd be very 'obvious' in the way I approach it.

If I'm at a road race, and I'm taking photos of people before or after, and I see a group of kids, I'll take the photo, but when I'm talking to the kids, I'll get them to point out who their parent/guardian is, and I'll say hello and make sure they're happy enough to have the photos published.

(I know I touched on it earlier, but for clarity, the reason I'd be asking isn't because I'm not allowed to take the photo. In a public place, everyone's fair game. The reason to get permission in this case is to avoid a situation of parents ringing up the paper giving out. Especially if it's a smaller/local paper, they simply don't want the negative image or hassle, which is understandable).

When I approach people saying "I am here for X newspaper, do you mind if I take a photo", the vast majority of people are delighted at the prospect, and will volunteer themselves and their kids for a photo.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 10-11-2018 5:52pm

McGaggs wrote: »

It always annoys me when I read or watch news reports about someone who's died or been injured and they use their Facebook picture. So much so that I idly think about putting it in my will that my estate should persue any news outlets that use my pictures if I die in a newsworthy manner.

I understand the annoyance. It can be disrespectful at times (especially in the situation of the newspaper asking permission and being told 'no', but going ahead anyway).

However, on the other side of the coin (as they say), you might find that a news story that has an actual person, a face, a likeness, attached to it, may carry more weight, and make a story resonate that bit more.

What I mean is, when you hear that John Johnson died in a car crash because a drunk driver had a head-on with him, and he had two kids and a wife... you turn the page, forget about it, and see if there's any cheap holiday deals on the next page.

However, if there's a photo of the family, with his innocent looking young kids and they're all smiling... John Johnson all of a sudden reminds you a bit of yourself, or your dad, or your brother.. It can make a story hit home a bit more, and you might condemn the drink driver that bit more as a result of having this visual addition to the story.

(of course, you might still not care, but it's one of the reasons I can see for using photos in those kind of situations).

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 10-11-2018 6:11pm

McGaggs wrote: »

Do you visit photography forum online like boards or Reddit? Do you use Flickr and/or Instagram? (Not looking for links, just wondering if a pro bothers with these).

Boards is where I learned all the basics of how to use a camera and set up for different shots. I was glued to the photography forum when I first started. Met a handful of boardsies in real life and did a couple of the photo walks. Have lost touch with most of them, but it was invaluable experience.

I believe I have accounts on all those named, but I use them rarely.

There's also a thing called Creative Live that do live videos of photographers coming in and doing their thing, teaching a few people in a classroom, which I always thought was good (people at home could submit questions via a live chat window). It's a great idea and it helped a lot.

Nowadays I rarely go looking to discuss photography online. I will still end up posting on photography forums from time to time, or if I'm on boards and see a question i can help with on the main page, I'll click in and reply to it, but in general most of my online browsing has very little to do with photography (although I still use Boards and Reddit, just different forums).

McGaggs wrote: »

A lot of online photography websites just focus on gear, but you seem to be pretty settled on your kit.

This is true, and it's one of the reasons I wouldn't be online too often for photo reasons.

However, it would often be a case that I know i'm going to have to photograph a solicitor, a cafe owner, a Garda, a mechanic, etc. and I've a bit of time beforehand, although I'll have a good idea what I plan to do, I'll often Google 'plumber portrait' or 'waitress portrait' to see if anything jumps out at me.

More recently I've started using drones, so I've googled them a bit, to see if there's anything worth learning that could help me out. Probably not really related to your question though.

Mech1 · 10-11-2018 11:29pm

would you be interested in bringing a "would be" photographer along with you on a shoot or even on a quick job?

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 11-11-2018 2:24am

Mech1 wrote: »

would you be interested in bringing a "would be" photographer along with you on a shoot or even on a quick job?

There was a period in time where I got a lot of 'work experience placement' emails. At the time, I said no. I was just getting my own foot on the ladder and figured that my diary wasn't filling up enough to justify having a work placement student with me.

On top of that, like most self employed, my early days were spent with a near single-digit bank balance and a worry of when will the phone ring. I might not have a job for weeks straight. There'd be no point in having someone tag along for that experience (unless they're a slacker and love getting the 'don't bother coming in today' calls).

I wouldn't feel comfortable having someone with me for two weeks, and not pay them something, which was another issue, as I genuinely didn't have the money.

Nowadays I'm doing a lot better, but no one has asked me in a long time. Someone from Transition Year in a nearby school asked me last year, but they opted for a video placement in a studio somewhere (I think) instead, before I got a chance to reply.

There is a chap I know, who is a friend of a friend, and he has tagged along a couple of times. Some jobs require accreditation and it makes it tricky having someone accompany you.

If it's something you're interested in, just ring a local paper and ask for their photographer's info. Most photographers won't mind you tagging along, because what will happen is they'll start sending you out to do their jobs for them, and pay you less than they're making (so they'll get paid for doing very little). You'll be happy with it because 'yay, you're a photographer', and they'll be happy because instead of making a small few euro doing a day for the paper, they can book a wedding in and give you the paper work.

(Eventually you'll outgrow it, but by that point you'll hopefully have become a bit more known by having worked for the paper and can get your own work on).

pampootie · 13-11-2018 9:35am

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA wrote: »

For example, I've stood at the roadside, photographing a fatal car accident.

How do the emergency services react to you being there at a time like this?

miamee · 13-11-2018 3:48pm

pampootie wrote: »

How do the emergency services react to you being there at a time like this?

Interesting question, I had assumed you were there to take 'official' photos for an investigation when it was mentioned earlier! Do you also get calls to do things like that for investigations or for official police/state records or anything?

gzoladz · 14-11-2018 8:08am

In relation to gear.. Nikon launched earlier this year the P1000. A compact sensor camera with 3000mm optical zoom.

Some profesional/serious photographers don't take it seriously due to the compromise of a small sensor in particular at the long end of the zoom, while some others do as they let them capture images of long distant objects/subjects that otherwise would not be possible with any other lens combination, if the light is right.

What's your take on it? Would you ever consider one for specific shooting situations or it is a no-go?

pjproby · 14-11-2018 11:18pm

Do you have your own studio?

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 15-11-2018 9:31pm

pampootie wrote: »

How do the emergency services react to you being there at a time like this?

They are well used to it, I'd imagine.

If you show a bit of respect to them, they'll show a bit of respect in return.

I always make an effort to approach Gardai at news events, and I inform them that I'll be taking a few photos. I prompt them so they can turn their back to the camera (they generally would rather not have their faces in the paper).

If I were a Garda, I would appreciate this opportunity to turn away from the camera, so I always put myself in their shoes.

Same if there are fire officers putting out a fire. I always approach them and tell them who I am and what I'm doing. It gives them a chance to make sure they've got all the proper safety gear on and they are "official" before a photo goes to the papers.

I've heard in the past of fire officers getting in trouble because they didn't have a certain piece of equipment on in a photo that appeared in the papers, which I think is unfair, considering the chaps are out trying to make an honest living.

So to answer you're question more directly, you'll find the emergency services don't really care whether you're there or not. Sometimes you might get an attitude, but it'd be rare, and I'd stand my ground if I got an unnecessary hard time off someone.

Gloomtastic! · 15-11-2018 10:18pm

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA wrote: »

They are well used to it, I'd imagine.

If you show a bit of respect to them, they'll show a bit of respect in return.

I always make an effort to approach Gardai at news events, and I inform them that I'll be taking a few photos. I prompt them so they can turn their back to the camera (they generally would rather not have their faces in the paper).

If I were a Garda, I would appreciate this opportunity to turn away from the camera, so I always put myself in their shoes.

Same if there are fire officers putting out a fire. I always approach them and tell them who I am and what I'm doing. It gives them a chance to make sure they've got all the proper safety gear on and they are "official" before a photo goes to the papers.

I've heard in the past of fire officers getting in trouble because they didn't have a certain piece of equipment on in a photo that appeared in the papers, which I think is unfair, considering the chaps are out trying to make an honest living.

So to answer you're question more directly, you'll find the emergency services don't really care whether you're there or not. Sometimes you might get an attitude, but it'd be rare, and I'd stand my ground if I got an unnecessary hard time off someone.

Did you pick up those tips from someone else or they did just come intuitively?

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 15-11-2018 11:31pm

miamee wrote: »

Interesting question, I had assumed you were there to take 'official' photos for an investigation when it was mentioned earlier! Do you also get calls to do things like that for investigations or for official police/state records or anything?

For newsworthy events, you get a call from the newspapers. For example, if you see a car accident that's caused huge delays, had a death, etc. The newspaper will contact the photographer.

I have taken photographs for the Gardai directly on a single occasion. It was generic photographs for use in presentations. To the best of my knowledge, anything that would be photographed for them, especially sensitive things like crime scenes, files, records, would be photographed by the forensics unit, and the photographer would be a sworn in, actual member of the Gardai.

I'm lead to believe that "back in the day", the average photographer on the street could get those jobs, but eventually it all started to get done 'in-house' (the right way to do it).

At least an actual Garda will be less likely to leak gore photos, whereas a photographer that works for both the Gardai and newspapers would have a conflict of interest and might be persuaded with a few euro (I presume this is why it's garda-only).

I have heard stories of a local freelance photographer that got work regularly off the Gardai, and now works for them full time despite not actually being a Garda. I'm hesitant to believe that story, although it could well be true.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 15-11-2018 11:49pm

gzoladz wrote: »

In relation to gear.. Nikon launched earlier this year the P1000. A compact sensor camera with 3000mm optical zoom.

Some profesional/serious photographers don't take it seriously due to the compromise of a small sensor in particular at the long end of the zoom, while some others do as they let them capture images of long distant objects/subjects that otherwise would not be possible with any other lens combination, if the light is right.

What's your take on it? Would you ever consider one for specific shooting situations or it is a no-go?

If you could get a decent 3000mm optical zoom that could give professional quality imagery, I'd expect to see it pitch-side at all major sporting events.

I'd certainly consider it to replace my "glovebox camera", but professionally I can't see use for it, for me personally (not saying it won't work for other photographers, but for what I tend to do, it'd be a while before I'd be glad I bought it).

You'll often find these "prosumer" cameras aren't as tough as their profesional cousins, either. I've dropped my DSLR more times than I'm proud to admit, and it's still working fine. I'm not sure I'd be confident I could say the same about the P1000.

Mind you, it's only fair to acknowledge how the technology is coming along. I'd say it won't be too long before the thoughts of having to change a lens seems archaic.

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 16-11-2018 12:00am

pjproby wrote: »

Do you have your own studio?

I don't. I was offered a retail unit a few years ago, at a knockdown rental price, and it would have been fine for studio use. It was also next to a church (I was thinking immediately of communions and confirmations).

Then I realised the money I would spend kitting it out, decorating, doing the store front signage and that I'd either have to be there all day, or pay someone else to be there all day.

I took a look at surrounding studios and realised that, firstly, lots of competition, and secondly, none of them looked too busy.

I do have a portable backdrop I use, so I can get a studio look to photos, but I don't have a proper dedicated studio, no.

My guess is that any studios that are still out there will slowly starting closing their doors as the years roll by.

I can't think of the name of the baby photo place, but they work within a baby shop, and so they can piggyback off an existing customer based, and run promotions that tie into the shop. Great marketing.

They can also rob you blind and guilt you into purchasing expensive images (someone has to pay for the rent and rates). Not my cup of tea, but I can see how it's successful (though I rarely hear good reports. The photos always seem good, but the prices scare a lot of people away).

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA · 16-11-2018 12:11am

Gloomtastic! wrote: »

Did you pick up those tips from someone else or they did just come intuitively?

A bit of both.

I always approach a Garda attending a scene. Mostly because I think it's just the right thing to do. I firmly believe in being polite to people, even at times when you don't have to be.

I found that when I approached a few of the Gardai they would jokingly ask not to get their face or would instinctively turn around. So I ended up asking about it and it seemed most Gardai simply don't want to be in the paper that much, which is understandable.

The fire safety equipment is something I heard about when chatting to a fire officer at a scene. I appeared at, I think it was a car fire, introduced myself to one of the fire officers, and he let a shout to one of the other gents to put certain gear on (I can't recall what it was off the top of my head. I think it was something trivial like a harness. He definitely wasn't missing his helmet or jacket or something obvious like that).

The officer I was talking to told me they had gotten in trouble not too long before that, because there was a photo of them in the paper, and they were missing certain equipment in the photos.

Ever since then, I've always made it a point to say it to them, and specifically remind them to throw on any gear they might be missing. 99.99% of the time they don't need to add or remove anything, but they always appreciate the heads up.

The only issue I have with it, is even though it's intended as a nice reminder and I'm trying to be decent to them, I sometimes feel like it might come across as though I feel I know better than them, or that I'm telling them how to do their own job. So I often feel awkward saying it, but better safe than sorry, I suppose.

Blazer · 16-11-2018 9:40am

I'm a Professional Photographer, AMA wrote: »

They may well be the dominant brand alright. When I'm on a job I rarely ever look at what anyone else is using. Unless it's obvious (like a white Canon lens) I'm generally unaware.

Of the photographers I know personally, Nikon certainly rules the roost.

It was always Nikon for portraits etc and Canon for sports as the lenses are better equipped for it.
Look on sky sports and you'll see Canon galore. Look on sky news and its mostly Nikon.
Also regarding Storage icloud/google drive/microsoft one drive are good options.
I'm hesitant to recommend flickr as they're changing again and its hard to see where they go from here. Pity as I always loved flickr. Stupid yahoo buying them.
Regardless you still want physical backups and especially in your role you'd want 2-3 copies of your work.

decky1 · 18-11-2018 2:00am

bought a Pentax K.r some time ago , bit over my head to be honest, just wanted something with a better zoom than the one i had ---have noticed in the last week the photo's are blurred,any tips?

Now ye're talking - to a professional photographer

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