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Ireland is now only 82% Native Irish.

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Comments

  • #62
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    coastwatch wrote: »
    It's a great development, we badly needed to add some "good lookin" genes to the irish gene pool, we were a bunch of pale and pasty freckle heads for far too long.
    Have you anything to say that is not based on racism? Self loathing racism is as ugly as any other kind.


  • #63
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    vladmydad wrote: »
    But are you saying if my Irish parents went to Japan and gave birth to me I would share the same genetics as the ancient Japanese people ? So therefore am I Japanese ? Does ethnicity matter ? And if not then why do we link certain ethnicities with certain geographical locations eg Chinese in China.

    You have some African, Japanese, Russian etc DNA (not necessarily those three but you do have DNA from multiple continents). You are not a true native! Damn...how will you live with yourself?


  • #64
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    kneemos wrote: »
    They can identify as Norwegians, they're still native Irish.

    According to........ you? Lol

    You're of the mistaken belief that your opinion somehow changes reality/facts..... it doesn't.


  • #65
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,440 ✭✭✭tigger123


    vladmydad wrote: »
    God I hope not, I’m just looking for a genuine discussion as it’s non existent anywhere in Irish media

    You do have an agenda here, and it's very clear by looking at your posts in this thread.


  • #66
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    realitykeeper wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    Without the racist, xenophobic accusations and all that crap, does anyone have any concerns about just how rapidly the Irish people are decreasing in Ireland ?
    It’s a very recent phenomenon and given that immigration into Ireland is ever increasing and that the birth rates of the “new” Irish are dramatically higher than natives. It is inevitable that 82% will soon be 70% , 55%, 40% etc.

    There is no debate in Irish media or politics about this and we have never voted on the issue. In fact it’s actually taboo. What are your thoughts?

    To me native Ireland is Irish speaking, Catholic and white so to me the native population is very small which is a pity but it is a fact I came to terms with long before Ireland pivoted from a country of mass emigration thirty years ago to immigration now.

    The reason I am not inclined to bemoan these changes is that I feel it the Irish have given up on themselves in not reviving the language, in failing to get rid of the drink culture and in our failure to adopt a work centric culture. I feel secularism is a bad development and that has happened independently of immigration so there again the Irish have failed.

    Being proud of being Irish is fine but when one is constantly disappointed, one tends to separate the chaff from the wheat or the good from the bad. I think where you have a people who are consistently doing the wrong thing, adopting the wrong attitudes and who have misplaced values, such a people are due a comeuppance. Elsewhere, there are countries with good people who have the right ideas and values. I think good people are leaving Ireland while people of questionable caliber remain. As for the immigrants, I think the checks and balances are flimsy at best but what else would you expect from the Irish.
    Absolutely, there is a strange thing happening in most of Western Europe. A sense of decline and retirement. As though Europe’s best days are behind it. A sense of shame about its past and a lack of appreciation of its incredible contribution to the world. I fear Cultural Marxism has done its job.


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  • #67
    stimpson
    Registered Users Posts: 7,815 ✭✭✭stimpson


    Peatys wrote: »
    Good strong Germanic Celt blood.

    Genetically we are Spanish, not German. We seem to have adopted Celtic art and culture from trading with Celtic tribes from Germany which is why it was assumed we were Celts, but the genetics don’t support it.


  • #68
    Deub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Deub


    vladmydad wrote: »
    But does anyone find the complete silence on the issue a little Orwellian, I mean it’s a radical societal change in just 20 years with unknown ramifications for future generations and yet it’s just not spoken of.

    But why is it an issue?
    It is easier to travel now than 100 years ago so it is only normal to see this change.


  • #69
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,407 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    MadDog76 wrote: »
    According to........ you? Lol

    You're of the mistaken belief that your opinion somehow changes reality/facts..... it doesn't.


    It's an indisputable fact that if you are born and raised here you are a native Irish.
    If you reject Irish culture for another you are a native Irish that has rejected Irish culture.


  • #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Do people care how low that % gets? Would it matter if there was a hypothetical surge in people moving over, say the UN migration pact actually ends up being implemented as its written, would it matter to the people on this thread if the foreign born population increased so much that in their kids adulthood the population born here became something like 50% or less?

    Would that be an issue


  • #71
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    tigger123 wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    God I hope not, I’m just looking for a genuine discussion as it’s non existent anywhere in Irish media

    You do have an agenda here, and it's very clear by looking at your posts in this thread.
    Of course I do. Talking about this is healthy and good. Stifling debate, as you are trying to do, is a dangerous thing and can have terrible consequences. So let’s talk about the experiment that is multiculturalism and see it’s benefits and negatives.


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  • #72
    Peatys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,881 ✭✭✭Peatys


    stimpson wrote: »
    Genetically we are Spanish, not German. We seem to have adopted Celtic art and culture from trading with Celtic tribes from Germany which is why it was assumed we were Celts, but the genetics don’t support it.

    Post edited


  • #73
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    Deub wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    But does anyone find the complete silence on the issue a little Orwellian, I mean it’s a radical societal change in just 20 years with unknown ramifications for future generations and yet it’s just not spoken of.

    But why is it an issue?
    It is easier to travel now than 100 years ago so it is only normal to see this change.
    When nations lose their sense of identity, historically it’s a disaster. I truly fear that things will get very very ugly in Europe over the next 50 years.


  • #74
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    kneemos wrote: »
    It's an indisputable fact that if you are born and raised here you are a native Irish.
    If you reject Irish culture for another you are a native Irish that has rejected Irish culture.

    Again, just based on YOUR opinion
    ........ so your "fact" is, in fact, being disputed.


  • #75
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    MadDog76 wrote: »
    Again, just based on YOUR opinion
    ........ so your "fact" is, in fact, being disputed.

    Opinions are like aholes, everyone has one. This raises the question, what is factually 'Native Irish'?


  • #76
    Deub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Deub


    vladmydad wrote: »
    When nations lose their sense of identity, historically it’s a disaster. I truly fear that things will get very very ugly in Europe over the next 50 years.

    Do you have an example?
    I am not irish so I would like to know the potential risk I brought to Ireland.


  • #77
    TCM
    Registered Users Posts: 736 ✭✭✭TCM


    Wheeliebin30 wrote:
    Hung drawn without any trial etc.

    Plumbthedepths wrote:
    My family came to Ulster during the 'Plantation' from Scotland before that from Norway.

    Give back the land.


  • #78
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    Deub wrote: »
    Do you have an example?
    I am not irish so I would like to know the potential risk I brought to Ireland.

    As a typical Irish person who has DNA that is from across the world due millennia of migration, I would also like to know what threat you pose me.

    Maybe I should have said 'Native Irish person'. Although, I'm still waiting on the official definition of what that means.


  • #79
    El Weirdo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,646 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    vladmydad wrote: »
    ... I’m just looking for a genuine discussion...

    If you blow a dog whistle, you're gonna end up surrounded by dogs.


  • #80
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    Deub wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    When nations lose their sense of identity, historically it’s a disaster. I truly fear that things will get very very ugly in Europe over the next 50 years.

    Do you have an example?
    I am not irish so I would like to know the potential risk I brought to Ireland.

    Yugoslavia, western Roman Empire, Austria-Hungary


  • #81
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    vladmydad wrote: »
    Yugoslavia, western Roman Empire, Austria-Hungary

    Are they all going to invade Ireland in the next 50 years? :pac:


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  • #82
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    ... I’m just looking for a genuine discussion...

    If you blow a dog whistle, you're gonna end up surrounded by dogs.
    So mass immigration cannot be discussed ?


  • #83
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    vladmydad wrote: »
    ... I’m just looking for a genuine discussion...

    If you blow a dog whistle, you're gonna end up surrounded by dogs.
    So mass immigration cannot be discussed ?


  • #84
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    vladmydad wrote: »
    So mass immigration cannot be discussed ?

    You are not discussing anything. You ignore any posts that contravene your beliefs.


  • #85
    vladmydad
    Registered Users Posts: 786 ✭✭✭vladmydad


    Fighting Tao wrote: »
    Deub wrote: »
    Do you have an example?
    I am not irish so I would like to know the potential risk I brought to Ireland.

    As a typical Irish person who has DNA that is from across the world due millennia of migration, I would also like to know what threat you pose me.

    Maybe I should have said 'Native Irish person'. Although, I'm still waiting on the official definition of what that means.
    So then there are no Irish ?


  • #86
    batgoat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,423 ✭✭✭batgoat


    vladmydad wrote: »
    When nations lose their sense of identity, historically it’s a disaster. I truly fear that things will get very very ugly in Europe over the next 50 years.

    Honestly you guys and your obsession with "native Irish" or "native British" is a tad sickening... It's a not so subtle of being racist. Your numbers aren't shocking or upsetting, we've become slightly more mixed in background. What's the harm?

    It's also probably better for the nations genetics to actually variety in the nation rather than everyone having a background that doesn't exit the nation.

    You can rave about unforeseen consequences but the reality is that it doesn't negatively affect us. Maybe go over to stormfront to have a proper discussion about it? They'll totally agree with you.


  • #87
    Fighting Tao
    Registered Users Posts: 6,482 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    vladmydad wrote: »
    So then there are no Irish ?

    Not as ethnically pure as you seem to think. We Irish are a mishmash of loads of different nationalities and cultures. Do some reading up on DNA and migration of people and you'll see that there is no such thing as a pure Irish person. Ethnic Irish Travellers are as close as it gets and they are a tiny percentage of the population.


  • #88
    y0ssar1an22
    Registered Users Posts: 15,913 ✭✭✭✭y0ssar1an22


    Fighting Tao wrote: »
    You are not discussing anything. You ignore any posts that contravene your beliefs.

    what are your belief on the matter do you mind sharing?


  • #89
    ablelocks
    Registered Users Posts: 4,673 ✭✭✭ablelocks


    vladmydad wrote: »
    Without the racist, xenophobic accusations and all that crap, does anyone have any concerns about just how rapidly the Irish people are decreasing in Ireland ?
    It’s a very recent phenomenon and given that immigration into Ireland is ever increasing and that the birth rates of the “new” Irish are dramatically higher than natives. It is inevitable that 82% will soon be 70% , 55%, 40% etc.

    There is no debate in Irish media or politics about this and we have never voted on the issue. In fact it’s actually taboo. What are your thoughts?

    if vlad is indeed your Dad, then it suggests that you're not exactly 100% "native" yourself.


  • #90
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    Fighting Tao wrote: »
    Opinions are like aholes, everyone has one. This raises the question, what is factually 'Native Irish'?

    True....... the "official" definition of native is simply to be born in country X but this definition has always been disputed for very valid reasons....... native Americans, for example, take issue with Donald Trump being defined as a native American.
    In fact, most Americans will define themselves as Irish, Italian, Polish etc. based on their genetic history whilst the rest of the world will define them as simply Americans or, if we're being courteous, Irish-American/Italian-American etc.

    So what is "native" isn't easily defined.


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  • #91
    Calina
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Calina


    The relevant statistic for Luxembourg is 52%.

    Any intelligent person is aware that human history is full of migratory movements. We wouldn't actually have got to Ireland otherwise. Irish is not a genetic construct it is a cultural, political and geographic construct.

    Discussions around native this and native that tend to miss that point. But I imagine the more people want to buy stupid DNA tests the more hung up on purity they will get. This discussion about native Irish is designed to be exclusionary.


This discussion has been closed.
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