Minister for Health Simon Harris and family trapped in home by protesters.

Homer · 11-02-2019 9:18am

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I think comparisons with Joan Burton being trapped in her car are a bit inappropriate. Way more confined space, and she couldnt even go for a slash when she needed to. I imagine it really was intimidating to have an angry crowd screaming abuse at you when you're in a space like that. The issue of Gardai lying in court doesn't really have an effect on whether it was intimidating.

This is all quite different to a dozen Facebook Mums & Dads holding a minor protest outside your front drive. I honestly think I'd just turn the TV up a bit, and leave them at it.

It wasn't 'nice' but let's not lose the run of ourselves.

Were you at the protest or have you seen video footage or are you just making that up that they were a dozen Facebook mums and dads :rolleyes:
Not terribly bright are you.

11-02-2019 9:19am

lawred2 wrote: »

Bit of a slippery slope that reasoning really

You do know that the term 'slippery slope' is a logical fallacy? Because one could just as easily argue that banning freedom of protest in a public space could also be described as a slippery slope - its just a creative way of turning something fairly mild into imminent panic.

evolving_doors · 11-02-2019 9:19am

Any pics or vids?

If not it's all been orchestrated, just like the agent provocateurs employed in Joan Burton's Tallaght theatre.

TCM · 11-02-2019 9:21am

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote:

When that politicians lies, bluffing and ineptitude affects your families lives ~ as his has done to many families I've no problem seeing protests brought to their door steps.

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote:

As for being 'trapped', sure he was at home. How was he trapped by anyone?.

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote:

From the video I seen it was a few gobsh*tes silently staging some kind of protest outside his house, hardly a siege.

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote:

We're all going to have to pay for this pricks lies and poor decision making, well I'm sick and tired of paying for poor decision after poor decision, for lie after lie time and time again. And while I don't advocate house calls by protesters I couldn't give a tup'penny's fvck about this idiot.

Bravo. Well said.

lawred2 · 11-02-2019 9:22am

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

You do know that the term 'slippery slope' is a logical fallacy? Because one could just as easily argue that banning freedom of protest in a public space could also be described as a slippery slope - its just a creative way of turning something fairly mild into imminent panic.

One could but that would be stupid

Annasopra · 11-02-2019 9:26am

lawred2 wrote: »

That's not really my point. I don't think that there is any acceptable level of protest on a politicians front door. Who is going to be the fair arbiter of acceptable levels of the protests?

It's amazing how quickly things can become normalized. The rapid plummet in the standards of public discourse in the US and UK attests to that.

This isn't a subjugated nation under a dictatorship. Like him or not, like FG or not, it's very hard to argue that these are politicians who aren't honestly trying to do their best.

I dont think any protest outside a politicians home is acceptable either but I dont have a problem with saying that comparing it to the violent agressive initimidation of what hsppened Joan Burton is not quite correct. There is spin on this to make us all feel a bit sorry for Harris here.

As I said though in my view protesting outside politicians homes is not acceptable.

lbc2019 · 11-02-2019 9:28am

So you dont have sympathy for Harris? I very much do. His private home being picketed with his young daughter inside is awful

Homer · 11-02-2019 9:31am

I don’t feel sorry for Harris in the slightest. You sign up for that knowing you’ll probably get a fair amount of abuse during your term in office, but intimidating his wife and new born child is scumbag behaviour and anyone that supports that is a lowlife.
Go stand outside his office all you want.

Gimme A Pound · 11-02-2019 9:34am

TCM wrote: »

Bravo. Well said.

Circle jerk alert.

Fiftyfilthy · 11-02-2019 9:41am

No harm done and the gards came within minutes which wouldn’t happen to most that ring them

The baby wouldn’t have known what was going on either

Not a big deal

Graces7 · 11-02-2019 9:43am

"So you dont have sympathy for Harris? I very much do. His private home being picketed with his young daughter inside is awful"

Agree wholeheartedly

Feisar · 11-02-2019 10:01am

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote: »

When that politicians lies, bluffing and ineptitude affects your families lives ~ as his has done to many families I've no problem seeing protests brought to their door steps.

As for being 'trapped', sure he was at home. How was he trapped by anyone?.

From the video I seen it was a few gobsh*tes silently staging some kind of protest outside his house, hardly a siege.

We're all going to have to pay for this pricks lies and poor decision making, well I'm sick and tired of paying for poor decision after poor decision, for lie after lie time and time again. And while I don't advocate house calls by protesters I couldn't give a tup'penny's fvck about this idiot.

Liliana Mealy Drugstore, I usually agree with stuff you post, generally you come across as level headed.

A middle class pen pusher is going to differ from someone like yourself in terms of how they are affected by protest outside their house.

On the poor decision making to be fair I'd say health is a juggernaught that ministers hop on an hope for the best. Very hard for one individual to effect change.

gandalf · 11-02-2019 10:04am

Liliana Mealy Drugstore wrote: »

When that politicians lies, bluffing and ineptitude affects your families lives ~ as his has done to many families I've no problem seeing protests brought to their door steps.

As for being 'trapped', sure he was at home. How was he trapped by anyone?.

From the video I seen it was a few gobsh*tes silently staging some kind of protest outside his house, hardly a siege.

We're all going to have to pay for this pricks lies and poor decision making, well I'm sick and tired of paying for poor decision after poor decision, for lie after lie time and time again. And while I don't advocate house calls by protesters I couldn't give a tup'penny's fvck about this idiot.

Well you are totally and utterly wrong. No matter how you feel about a politician you do not drag his family into this. To accept this is going down a very dark alley way. What next you condone assaulting the guy, sure why not go the full Jo Cox and allow him to be slaughtered on the street to placate the baying crowds. The only idiots I see are the ones condoning this behaviour.

The Health Service and other departments will only be brought into line when senior civil servants can be fired outright for incompetence. Harris has as much control on this as someone trying to catch a greased eel in a vat of ky jelly. Normally when you amalgamate organisations you can make redundant the surplus/duplicated staff, not here under Bertie no we held onto thousands of middle managers who effectively had no jobs. The Health Service has been a disaster for nearly thirty years now, what do expect when we have a ratio of 3 admin staff for every front line nurse. Harris has done a sh!te job but lets be honest he is only working to the level of his predecessors and unless a Minister and Government can (and want to) deal with the staffing issues things are not going to change.

Camping gobsh!tes outside of peoples private homes is not the answer, ensuring that taxpayers money is spent in the majority on front line services and not on allowing some pencil pusher who doesn't have a role to fill their seat until retirement is.

GreeBo · 11-02-2019 10:04am

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

No, it's Healthcare Economics 101. We all know that economic decisions made in the provision of healthcare governance will affect health outcomes and mortality rates, the issue here is that decisions are being traded in favour of middle-class votes, ie tax reductions vs appropriate healthcare.

So why not protest outside the homes of the people who voted this government into power then?

meeeeh · 11-02-2019 10:10am

Actually healthcare in Ireland is very much affected by not dealing with unions and not ny throwing enough money at it. European healthcare index marks quite a few of European countries spending less for healthcare better than Ireland. Unions are just as responsible for the state of health in Ireland as is the government.

whisky_galore · 11-02-2019 10:14am

My heart bleeds for him. I couldn't care less.
No one died at the end of the day.

GBX · 11-02-2019 10:21am

A few people saying protest outside government buildings rather than the home, why not the home? If canvassing for votes, politicians can knock on anybodies door without welcome regardless of their political views. Granted most people would tell them where to go.

Wheeliebin30 · 11-02-2019 10:22am

GBX wrote: »

A few people saying protest outside government buildings rather than the home, why not the home? If canvassing for votes, politicians can knock on anybodies door without welcome regardless of their political views. Granted most people would tell them where to go.

Yeah that’s exactly the same alright.

gmisk · 11-02-2019 10:25am

whisky_galore wrote: »

My heart bleeds for him. I couldn't care less.
No one died at the end of the day.

How would you feel if due to your perceived poor performance at your job you had a group of strangers outside your door holding up signs?
I am sure you would be delighted!

Annasopra · 11-02-2019 10:25am

GBX wrote: »

A few people saying protest outside government buildings rather than the home, why not the home? If canvassing for votes, politicians can knock on anybodies door without welcome regardless of their political views. Granted most people would tell them where to go.

I dont agree with the home. Its overstepping the mark into a persons private life. Its intimidating towards the persons home and their neighbours. Canvassing is an entirely seaparate thing.

GAA Beo · 11-02-2019 10:28am

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

Boggles · 11-02-2019 10:31am

gandalf wrote: »

The Health Service and other departments will only be brought into line when senior civil servants can be fired outright for incompetence. Harris has as much control on this as someone trying to catch a greased eel in a vat of ky jelly.

Well that isn't strictly true, legislation can passed (quite quickly) that would give the Minister for Health oversight over Senior Managers.

He has been harping on about it since he took up the role.

The reality is the HSE is a God send for the Minister of Health, gives them a near complete buffer of culpability.

His current pickle though has nothing to do with the HSE, they didn't make him tell porkies in the Dáil.

Billcarson · 11-02-2019 10:31am

Pinned like rats in a hole. Wonder were harris and his wife running about inside their house trying to put up barricades etc. Checking their supplies. Checking their weapons and ammo. Waiting for the massive mob outside their house to rush the house at anytime.

Annasopra · 11-02-2019 10:32am

GAA Beo wrote: »

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

More bullsh>t about how anyone who voices concenern is a blueshirt and doesnt give a sh>t about nurses or the health service. Utter utter bul**** and whataboutery.
Many of the people saying they dont support picketing Harriss house are supporters of other parties and are active on health service issues.

Wheeliebin30 · 11-02-2019 10:32am

GAA Beo wrote: »

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

Who died because of this government?

whisky_galore · 11-02-2019 10:33am

gmisk wrote: »

How would you feel if due to your perceived poor performance at your job you had a group of strangers outside your door holding up signs?
I am sure you would be delighted!

It's not my problem.

Typical Irish 'ah shur God luv him' responses here.

Snow Garden · 11-02-2019 10:33am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

You said " I would say all functions and all grades except front line staff".

They're not front line staff, so do you want them to be fired or not? Presumably not, based on your reaction.

Now are there any other front line staff you don't want fired? The people who purchase the supplies and equpment - should they be fired? The people who run the payroll operation - should they be fired?

If your own proposal of " I would say all functions and all grades except front line staff" doesn't really stand up, maybe you'd like to tell us again who should be fired?

You are just being a weasel now on purpose. You are nit picking on words. It would be stupid to lay off all non front line staff. I never said that. I said there should have been compulsory redundancies across all grades and functions when the HSE was set up. This isn't news. Why are you smokescreening?

Listen to Maurice Neligan...

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/the-hse-can-t-work-out-how-many-staff-it-has-1.766165

Now, as you all know by now, the HSE has some difficulty with figures. It can’t figure out how much PPARS (personnel, payroll and related systems) cost, or maybe it doesn’t want us to know. The latest debacle with the insurers could cost us €50 million, according to Prof Drumm, or nothing at all according to Minister Harney. It’s the way you tell ’em.

Then there are the conflicting reports as to how many actually work in the service. There seem to be about 112,000, give or take a few thousand. I became bogged down in this particular morass when I quoted figures used by three stockbroking firms, Davy, NCB and Goodbody in a joint paper issued on April 2nd. They averred that in the HSE there were about 49,000 administrative staff and 61,000 frontline staff and that such a ratio was unsustainable.

lawred2 · 11-02-2019 10:33am

GAA Beo wrote: »

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

another barstool saviour

gmisk · 11-02-2019 10:33am

GAA Beo wrote: »

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

Genuine question, how would you feel if the same thing happened to you?
A protest at your front door, with banners when you have a 3 week old new born in the house would you be happy about it?

BTW the INMO have strongly condemned it.

"The INMO and its members condemn in the strongest possible terms the protests today outside Minister Harris' family home. The protests are completely inappropriate."

meeeeh · 11-02-2019 10:34am

GAA Beo wrote: »

Great way for Harris to play the woe is me and victim card now. Doubt this protest was up to much but I have no sympathy for the man. Of course the Fine Gael trolls and cheerleaders are everywhere with their faux outrage. Yet no outrage about the nurses pay, homeless, housing or the corruption and scandal about the childrens hospital.

People are dying because of this governement, but we should be outraged about some nonsense like this. **** Fine Gael, **** their pen pals in the Indo and **** Harris the weasel faced bastard.

Just about anyone condemned this except possibly Paul Murphy. Don't blame Harris for using protesting morons to strengthen his position. Anybody would and the sad part it the protesters were to dumb to realise that kind of thuggery will backfire.

Minister for Health Simon Harris and family trapped in home by protesters.

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