Poverty spec?

swarlb · 12-02-2019 9:56am #1

There has been a lot of talk on here about 'poverty spec' and 'paddy spec' cars. So, in current climate, what exactly constitutes 'poverty' or 'paddy' spec.
If I think of poverty, I tend to associate it with having 'nothing'... so as an example a car with decent cloth upholstery as opposed to leather does not equate to 'poverty' if the model in question does not have a leather option available.
It should mean that one model comes with absolutely 'nothing', no radio, no Bluetooth, no central locking, doors that open using by sticking the key in the lock, rubber carpets, only one external mirror, no rear wipers etc etc..

Is there such a thing as a car with 'poverty' spec ?? And I don't mean picking some model that ceased production decades ago, or anecdotal stories about cars with wicker work chairs held in place by pop rivets.

Del2005 · 12-02-2019 10:05am

If a car does not come with a leather seat option its a poverty spec car.

swarlb · 12-02-2019 10:13am

Del2005 wrote: »

If a car does not come with a leather seat option its a poverty spec car.

I completely disagree, as you could order a top of the range Tesla or Range Rover for example, and not order leather yet get every other option available. I'm talking about cars that come with NOTHING as standard, with no options available.
Personally, I don't think there is one.

hi5 · 12-02-2019 10:14am

A poverty spec car is the base model of a range that doesn't have any of the option boxes ticked.
What's provided as standard with the base model can vary from manufacture to manufacture.

mickdw · 12-02-2019 10:25am

Get the cheapest dacia you can find and you should be pretty close.

12-02-2019 10:36am

No passenger sun visor

NIMAN · 12-02-2019 10:37am

mickdw wrote: »

Get the cheapest dacia you can find and you should be pretty close.

Or high end Dacia;)

zilog_jones · 12-02-2019 10:38am

Look at the cheapest rental cars. I was surprised to see keep-fit windows in the rear of a '18 Fiesta.

I doubt you could get something without central locking or no passenger side mirror these days.

MarcusP12 · 12-02-2019 10:42am

hi5 wrote: »

A poverty spec car is the base model of a range that doesn't have any of the option boxes ticked.
What's provided as standard with the base model can vary from manufacture to manufacture.

This is all you need to know above.....

I think its a term that's synonymous with premium German motors back in the day whereby there has been an obsession with simply having the badge rather than any of the extra comforts that come with them at a cost, i.e. they'd rather go entry level for not much more than say the top spec Mondeo or passat so that they can say I drive a beemer or merc for example.

It's why a lot of people go for UK imports as they tend to come with a lot of optional extras. For example I picked up a UK import 5 series MSport which came with reversing cameras, pro sat nav, HK stereo and adaptive dampers. You'd do well to pick up an irish car as well spec'ed. But then, you'd hardly call the standard spec MSport, "poverty spec" any more so its probably a bit of an outdated term.....

I personally think its a term that's no longer relevant in the spirit it was originally intended. Premium motors no longer carry the allure they used to and even so, base level specs are decent these days.

Maybe manufacturers have copped on to this with their trim levels. Seems to be much more variety these days with trim levels compared to years ago, especially with premium german cars. Maybe they realized through research that people were much more willing to pay a reasonable premium for a higher level of trim rather than pay for "extras" against the standard car, i.e. you know straight away what you're paying rather than going through a tick list of items and getting a shock when you see the bottom line figure. Just a theory......

swarlb · 12-02-2019 10:42am

hi5 wrote: »

A poverty spec car is the base model of a range that doesn't have any of the option boxes ticked.
What's provided as standard with the base model can vary from manufacture to manufacture.

Some manufacturers have provided models that came with a myriad of 'standard' features, with options such a leather, or panoramic sunroof for example, as 'options'. So in essence the base model was far from poverty ridden.
What I'm trying to tease out here, is the quote often used that such and such is 'paddy spec' where in actual fact the cars in question are very well equipped, just not to the liking of the few.

NIMAN · 12-02-2019 10:43am

It seems to be a fading concept?

More Irish cars are coming with a lot more standard equipment than they used to. Its probably to compete with UK imports etc.

kooga · 12-02-2019 10:47am

I was looking at the new Peugeot Ritter - did a comparison with the uk spec Ritter initially all looked good same trims in the roi as uk but when I enquired about the gt line spec was told that the sunroof which is standard on the uk model is not standard here nor is it available as an option - even though I had the option code the dealer said it couldn’t be specced - no satisfactory explanation given

zilog_jones · 12-02-2019 10:52am

Yeah, there are still a lot of cars that are worse spec here than their UK equivalents, probably because of the expense of VRT. Not to the same extent as in the past in that the baseline is higher, but there is still a gap.

fancy pigeon · 12-02-2019 10:55am

MarcusP12 wrote: »

This is all you need to know above.....

I think its a term that's synonymous with premium German motors back in the day whereby there has been an obsession with simply having the badge rather than any of the extra comforts that come with them at a cost, i.e. they'd rather go entry level for not much more than say the top spec Mondeo or passat so that they can say I drive a beemer or merc for example.

I have a 95 C220 D. It has windy windows all round, orange indicators and steel wheels

I can't imagine a modern C class appearing with the same spec as my one!

Mitch Connor · 12-02-2019 10:55am

swarlb wrote: »

I completely disagree, as you could order a top of the range Tesla or Range Rover for example, and not order leather yet get every other option available. I'm talking about cars that come with NOTHING as standard, with no options available.
Personally, I don't think there is one.

Then they come with a leather seat option, so do not fall into the poverty spec category the poster is talking about.

They said if there isn't the OPTION for leather seats - not that you simply don't select them.

MarcusP12 · 12-02-2019 11:01am

fancy pigeon wrote: »

I have a 95 C220 D. It has windy windows all round, orange indicators and steel wheels

I can't imagine a modern C class appearing with the same spec as my one!

I think it also to do with technology advancement....years ago all electric windows was considered a luxury but now it's standard pretty much all round...cruise control used to be rare enough but is standard for a lot of regular cars...even sat nav and parking sensors are become increasingly standard on a lot of cars even in standard spec....the term was conjured up when things we take for granted these days were quite expensive as extras....I don't think much has changed in terms of us buying extras compared to our uk counterparts but to term it poverty spec is no longer applicable I'd say.....

Eric Cartman · 12-02-2019 11:02am

NIMAN wrote: »

It seems to be a fading concept?

More Irish cars are coming with a lot more standard equipment than they used to. Its probably to compete with UK imports etc.

Thats dealers doing it to stop them ending up with forecourts full of crap though, in the UK you can get a lower spec model in almost any car but so few people do that dealers will make it available.

Bog spec is any car at the lowest trim level with no options, there can also be some exceptions where the new buyer is particularly stingy , example - new seat ibiza, windy windows in the rear, getting them electric is 200 quid, why anyone wouldnt do this or any dealer wouldnt order their lot cars without it is beyond me.

Eric Cartman · 12-02-2019 11:06am

kooga wrote: »

I was looking at the new Peugeot Ritter - did a comparison with the uk spec Ritter initially all looked good same trims in the roi as uk but when I enquired about the gt line spec was told that the sunroof which is standard on the uk model is not standard here nor is it available as an option - even though I had the option code the dealer said it couldn’t be specced - no satisfactory explanation given

This one is a funny one , vw ireland wont order you a cream interior on anything lesser than a mid spec golf, a lot of other companies offer cream interiors in other countries which are ‘not available’ in ireland, no idea why

Leonard Hofstadter · 12-02-2019 11:35am

No a/c as standard in 2019 is just unforgivable. Surely everything has that and alloy wheels as well.

To be fair, most cars are very well equipped these days, even in Ireland, go back to say 2002 or 2003 and you'll find the likes of a Golf came with keep fit windows (all round), manual exterior mirror adjustment, hubcaps and no central locking as standard, that was Paddy spec.

Henry Ford III · 12-02-2019 12:14pm

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

No a/c as standard in 2019 is just unforgivable. Surely everything has that and alloy wheels as well.

To be fair, most cars are very well equipped these days, even in Ireland, go back to say 2002 or 2003 and you'll find the likes of a Golf came with keep fit windows (all round), manual exterior mirror adjustment, hubcaps and no central locking as standard, that was Paddy spec.

Agreed although the basic car drove just the same as the high spec. version.

MrMusician18 · 12-02-2019 12:24pm

As with all things "poverty" can be relative and absolute. The most basic cars of old with few by of features, such as one sun visor, one wing mirror, and windy windows would be absolutely low spec. In modern terms this can extend to a car that is equipped poorly relative to expectations in it's class (such as windy rear windows).

Relatively low spec would be the base model of a particular car with no options installed.

You can therefore have poverty spec in any car, depending on your frame of reference.

mickdw · 12-02-2019 12:48pm

Lots of cars now fitted with steel wheels designed to fit behind an alloy look wheel trim so alloys are from a given.

ednwireland · 12-02-2019 12:52pm

looking for a used car and wont look at something that doesnt have alloy wheels, decent stereo (preferably some sort of mp3 playing) , bluetooth preferably sterring whheel controls, would like in seperate airccon controls for driver / passenger, amazing how many cars it rules out (2011-2013 cars).

Gazzmonkey · 12-02-2019 12:58pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Yeah, there are still a lot of cars that are worse spec here than their UK equivalents, probably because of the expense of VRT. Not to the same extent as in the past in that the baseline is higher, but there is still a gap.

Bingo

You got it in one..

The UK spec cars don't have to absorb VRT cost so they have more bells & whistles.

Never bought a paddy spec, never will.

Toyotafanboi · 12-02-2019 12:58pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Bog spec is any car at the lowest trim level with no options, there can also be some exceptions where the new buyer is particularly stingy , example - new seat ibiza, windy windows in the rear, getting them electric is 200 quid, why anyone wouldnt do this or any dealer wouldnt order their lot cars without it is beyond me.

Because you're at the end of the market where people will leave a deal over €20, it'd be near suicide for a dealer to factory order a load of stock with a €200 accessory that would go un-noticed to most.

pa990 · 12-02-2019 1:42pm

There is a demand for poverty spec cars amoung three groups of clients.

1. Those that just need a car, and need the cheapest possible motor possible , be it new or second hand.

2. Those that want to keep up with the Jone's

3. Company cars, ie Security patrol vans / Garda cars, where the company want something that will move personell from A to B at the least cost possible.

If there was no demand for these poverty spec vehicles, the manufacturers wouldn't supply them .
Just like a few years ago, petrol versions of various cars weren't available in this country because there was no demand for petrol, .. only diesel.

kooga · 12-02-2019 2:14pm

pa990 wrote: »

There is a demand for poverty spec cars amoung three groups of clients.

1. Those that just need a car, and need the cheapest possible motor possible , be it new or second hand.

2. Those that want to keep up with the Jone's

3. Company cars, ie Security patrol vans / Garda cars, where the company want something that will move personell from A to B at the least cost possible.

If there was no demand for these poverty spec vehicles, the manufacturers wouldn't supply them .
Just like a few years ago, petrol versions of various cars weren't available in this country because there was no demand for petrol, .. only diesel.

Agree for example Toyota GB offer the landcruiser in utility spec- steel wheels etc - id gladly take that over having to buy the commercial GX model here which is unnecessary hi spec

JoeA3 · 12-02-2019 3:21pm

It's a very subjective term and it varies from one model to another... so, as an extreme example, a BMW 5 series with cloth seats and a manual gearbox would be a total no-no and positively sale-proof. Whereas a manual box and cloth seats are perfectly acceptable in a run of the mill hatchback.

I don't think "paddy spec" is as bad as it used to be. With BMW for example, the Irish specs are equivalent to UK spec here now. With VAG, the Irish cars tend to be better spec'd than UK as standard. This is the very opposite to how it used to be. Of course, the UK buyers do tend to opt for the larger more powerful engines in much greater numbers than we do, but a new Irish 520d is spec'd the same as a UK one.

Irish buyers are a bit more choosy these days I think and spec is important for certain cars (e.g. the BMW example above!).

Personally there's a few toys and creature comforts that I've come to expect in a car and I would not consider buying a car missing them (off the top of my head - xenons/LEDs, heated seats, decent audio with modern phone connectivity, decent wheels, climate control..)

biko · 12-02-2019 4:42pm

It's a old term meaning the UK got all the goodie trim levels but Paddy was too cheap to get anything but the bare minimum so dealers only got base level diesels for the Irish market.

MetzgerMeister · 12-02-2019 5:51pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

This one is a funny one , vw ireland wont order you a cream interior on anything lesser than a mid spec golf, a lot of other companies offer cream interiors in other countries which are ‘not available’ in ireland, no idea why

It's because of the filth of us all shur. A cream leather interior would be black in a matter of days after Paddy hopping from the tractor into the Golf to go to mass :pac:

My opinion of Paddy spec is the cheapest model of a car available, mainly the likes of a 3 series that has absolutely no options at all. Generally purchased by those wanting the badge.

swarlb · 12-02-2019 8:08pm

MetzgerMeister wrote: »

It's because of the filth of us all shur. A cream leather interior would be black in a matter of days after Paddy hopping from the tractor into the Golf to go to mass :pac:

My opinion of Paddy spec is the cheapest model of a car available, mainly the likes of a 3 series that has absolutely no options at all. Generally purchased by those wanting the badge.

I love the self depreciating nature of some of these posts, we Irish certainly have a very low opinion of ourselves at times.

Poverty spec?

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