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Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Les Miserables SEE MOD WARNING POST #1924 + #2755

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 6,773 Mod ✭✭✭✭connemara man


    Something's gotta Gibbe


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,728 ✭✭✭Former Former


    "Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Deckchairs on the Titanic, sure it was only built down the road, hi"


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    The Final Ulster Team Talk Thread


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭blackdog1


    Jones was excellent and was much better than the much vaunted Deysel


    Thought Rea was very good when he came on. I was not impressed with Jones rucking... Very poor. Also him and timoney are poor at the maul body positioning way too high. On the plus side he had good feet in the carry and I thought he tackled excellently.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Neil3030 wrote: »
    Les Kisserables
    Les Miserables is probably as apt as you need.

    For a team that has a working squad down in the twenties and have still managed to win more games in the league than Munster and have a realistic chance of getting out of their CC pool, you'd think they were dragging around the bottom of the league with nothing to play for by the sound of things around here. :rolleyes:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,724 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    prawnsambo wrote: »
    Neil3030 wrote: »
    Les Kisserables
    Les Miserables is probably as apt as you need.

    For a team that has a working squad down in the twenties and have still managed to win more games in the league than Munster and have a realistic chance of getting out of their CC pool, you'd think they were dragging around the bottom of the league with nothing to play for by the sound of things around here. :rolleyes:

    This place is tame compared to other places.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    bilston wrote: »
    This place is tame compared to other places.
    True. But echo chambers do tend to be a lot louder than normal environments. ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Post it here rather than youths/schools threads but Ulster have an under 19s squad playing Canada under 19s in CIYMs tonight
    http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/16870.php#.Wku38dIiHIU


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,889 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    prawnsambo wrote: »
    Les Miserables is probably as apt as you need.

    For a team that has a working squad down in the twenties and have still managed to win more games in the league than Munster and have a realistic chance of getting out of their CC pool, you'd think they were dragging around the bottom of the league with nothing to play for by the sound of things around here. :rolleyes:

    The problems are many. Starting with idiotic team selection. No chance of players getting the opportunity to develop understandings with regular partners. Never play the same centres together for example. Or playing Bowe at 13 when Cave and Ludik are available. Or playing back row players in the second row while playing second rows in the back row. Or selecting Cairns v. Leinster, he has a good game and then gets turfed off the airport bus by Kiss and hasn'r been seen again. Playing Beagle when Shanahan, Cairns or Ethel the Tea lady are better. Nelson at 10 is a sad reflection on the squad.

    Then there are the actual performances over the last 2 years since Kiss took over.
    So far this season in 12 league games Ulster have conceded 37 tries.
    In 22 games last season the conceded 47. FORTY SEVEN. FFS This season it could be closer to 70.
    In 15 / 16 season Ulster conceded only 29 in 22 games, only bettered by Leinster on 27.
    In 14 / 15 it was 34.
    In 13 / 14 it was 26. So Ulster had a great defensive record before the 'DEFENCE COACH' took over. Now it's a joke.

    Them there are the teams Ulster have actually played. Mostly the bottom feeders who have scored at will. Losing to Zebre ffs.

    The team has shown individual skill at times but the cohesive teamwork of a bunch of hermits. Most of the players are those who have performed really well before Kiss arrived so why are they playing like girl guides now?

    O.K. there are significant players missing all or most of the season. Coetzee, Best, Payne, Jackson, Olding, Luke Marshall, Henry, Browne, Deysel, V.D. Merwe etc plus the ageing lags of Trimble and Bowe all makes for a perfect storm of pig slurry when you factor in the jokeshop coach input.


  • Registered Users Posts: 960 ✭✭✭Scythica


    I want FOLK in the tagline but can't think of anything witty enough to use it in


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    jacothelad wrote: »
    The problems are many. Starting with idiotic team selection. No chance of players getting the opportunity to develop understandings with regular partners. Never play the same centres together for example. Or playing Bowe at 13 when Cave and Ludik are available. Or playing back row players in the second row while playing second rows in the back row. Or selecting Cairns v. Leinster, he has a good game and then gets turfed off the airport bus by Kiss and hasn'r been seen again. Playing Beagle when Shanahan, Cairns or Ethel the Tea lady are better. Nelson at 10 is a sad reflection on the squad.
    I took the time to produce that table for a reason. I was kind of hoping that some of you would help develop it a bit more, but as far as I can see, Ludik played pretty much every game bar a few and a couple of subs. Cave is a mystery nobody can answer, but that may be over now. But the overarching view that table provides is of a very thin squad that is dictating match-day selections by injury rather than design.
    jacothelad wrote: »
    Then there are the actual performances over the last 2 years since Kiss took over.
    So far this season in 12 league games Ulster have conceded 37 tries.
    In 22 games last season the conceded 47. FORTY SEVEN. FFS This season it could be closer to 70.
    In 15 / 16 season Ulster conceded only 29 in 22 games, only bettered by Leinster on 27.
    In 14 / 15 it was 34.
    In 13 / 14 it was 26. So Ulster had a great defensive record before the 'DEFENCE COACH' took over. Now it's a joke.

    Them there are the teams Ulster have actually played. Mostly the bottom feeders who have scored at will. Losing to Zebre ffs.
    Teams are conceding more tries now because of the changes to the laws. Which was the idea, I believe. 37 is not good, but Ulster's pack is just not good enough. Three pack related tries yesterday and only four missed tackles tells the story really.

    Zebre defeat was horrible alright. After four straight wins, it was hard to take. And not exactly a seconds squad either. A lot of senior players on the pitch who should have done a lot better. Perhaps an attitude problem? Lads thinking the game was won before they took the field? Dragons away seemed to be the same kind of malaise. :mad:
    jacothelad wrote: »
    The team has shown individual skill at times but the cohesive teamwork of a bunch of hermits. Most of the players are those who have performed really well before Kiss arrived so why are they playing like girl guides now?

    O.K. there are significant players missing all or most of the season. Coetzee, Best, Payne, Jackson, Olding, Luke Marshall, Henry, Browne, Deysel, V.D. Merwe etc plus the ageing lags of Trimble and Bowe all makes for a perfect storm of pig slurry when you factor in the jokeshop coach input.
    I'm inclined to the view that some of the senior players are not giving it the full effort in the lesser matches and it shows. It seems that they can be up for the big ones and the home matches, but not arsed when it's some bottom feeder away. Not sure you can point the finger wholly at the coaches there. The younger guys look eager and enthused and willing to give 100% for the full 80. Stockdale plays with a smile on his face as does Lyttle etc.

    But it's hard to kick arses when there are no options threatening from behind. A bit of depth may change attitudes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,889 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    Scythica wrote: »
    I want FOLK in the tagline but can't think of anything witty enough to use it in

    "What the FOLK?"


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,769 ✭✭✭Utah_Saint


    jacothelad wrote: »
    Scythica wrote: »
    I want FOLK in the tagline but can't think of anything witty enough to use it in

    "What the FOLK?"

    Ulster FOLK and transport museum


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,742 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Scythica wrote: »
    I want FOLK in the tagline but can't think of anything witty enough to use it in

    Folk songs and treason?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,769 ✭✭✭Utah_Saint


    jacothelad wrote: »
    Scythica wrote: »
    I want FOLK in the tagline but can't think of anything witty enough to use it in

    "What the FOLK?"

    Queer as FOLK


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Can't please some FOLK. ;)

    Which works on both levels.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,687 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    FOLK Kiss out!


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,752 ✭✭✭✭mfceiling


    FOLK OFF LES...


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,601 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    LOST ALL FOLK KISS


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,975 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Knees are FOLKed


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Lads, you can't use an acronym in a sentence and not have the sentence work with the words the acronym stands for. Basic stuff here, you're not covering yourselves in glory. A bit like Ulster. :D




  • Over the years I've worked with some people that just didn't give a damn. Didn't try and had to be constantly managed to get anything done. Their lack of bother seeped into everything they did and nothing would really ever phase them.

    I've also worked with people that cared too much. People that would work themselves into the ground if you let them, and would be swelling with anxiety if they weren't performing.

    Les Kiss strikes me as much closer to the latter. It's possible that he may be out of his depth but I don't see someone that isn't trying. His words and demeanour after the Connacht game would suggest that the troubles facing Ulster are very much affecting him personally.

    He is trying to get a serially under performing team to perform whilst struggling to manage an incredibly difficult and almost unprecedented situation with injuries and unavailability of players.

    I think anyone who is genuinely calling for him to 'f**k off' should really be ashamed of themselves. He doesn't deserve anything like that kind of rhetoric thrown at him.

    People would do well to remember, this is not soccer.

    1387228426_0.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,889 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    molloyjh wrote: »
    Folk songs and treason?
    Folk Off....The Menu.:D


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,166 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    Who Gibbes a FOLK?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    The way things are going should the thread title not be Leinster “B” Team Les be having you?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,769 ✭✭✭Utah_Saint


    Over the years I've worked with some people that just didn't give a damn. Didn't try and had to be constantly managed to get anything done. Their lack of bother seeped into everything they did and nothing would really ever phase them.

    I've also worked with people that cared too much. People that would work themselves into the ground if you let them, and would be swelling with anxiety if they weren't performing.

    Les Kiss strikes me as much closer to the latter. It's possible that he may be out of his depth but I don't see someone that isn't trying. His words and demeanour after the Connacht game would suggest that the troubles facing Ulster are very much affecting him personally.

    He is trying to get a serially under performing team to perform whilst struggling to manage an incredibly difficult and almost unprecedented situation with injuries and unavailability of players.

    I think anyone who is genuinely calling for him to 'f**k off' should really be ashamed of themselves. He doesn't deserve anything like that kind of rhetoric thrown at him.

    People would do well to remember, this is not soccer.

    1387228426_0.jpg


    I don't doubt Les is trying his best but it looks like his best it's just good enough. Not a single Ulster fan wishes ill will on Les but the team are a state and are getting much worse.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Utah_Saint wrote: »
    I don't doubt Les is trying his best but it looks like his best it's just good enough. Not a single Ulster fan wishes ill will on Les but the team are a state and are getting much worse.
    While utterly failing to see that the problems are not of his making?

    Whatever about the first half, and accepting that the red card made it an easier job, the comeback in the second half was already in motion at that stage and there were a lot of positives about how Ulster went about winning that match. Not least that only four tackles were missed in the entire match. Pack was mauled and scrummaged off the pitch, but did you expect any better from that unit?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,769 ✭✭✭Utah_Saint


    prawnsambo wrote: »
    Utah_Saint wrote: »
    I don't doubt Les is trying his best but it looks like his best it's just good enough. Not a single Ulster fan wishes ill will on Les but the team are a state and are getting much worse.
    While utterly failing to see that the problems are not of his making?

    Whatever about the first half, and accepting that the red card made it an easier job, the comeback in the second half was already in motion at that stage and there were a lot of positives about how Ulster went about winning that match. Not least that only four tackles were missed in the entire match. Pack was mauled and scrummaged off the pitch, but did you expect any better from that unit?

    Certainly some things are out of kiss's control but he's coming up on 3 years in charge and things have been getting progressively worse. Particularly around the area where he is a specialist.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,549 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Utah_Saint wrote: »
    Certainly some things are out of kiss's control but he's coming up on 3 years in charge and things have been getting progressively worse. Particularly around the area where he is a specialist.
    Four missed tackles in an entire match? Against Munster?

    But yes, I've seen a good few of Ulster's matches this season and some of the input, especially from experienced players has been laughably bad. But I don't blame the coach for that. That's an attitude issue and that's down to players who know they won't be dropped because they're internationals or because they have no real competition. So they can phone it in when it suits them and there's the square root of feck all Kiss can do about it without making bizarre selections.

    Oh... wait...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,775 ✭✭✭b.gud


    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: A,Les-gory of the Cave
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: The Best is yet to Callum
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Jonno and the Hendersons
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Dibs on Gibbs
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: If you poach Ross Byrne I'll be piiiisssed
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Rodney you plonker
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Friends don't let friends double team
    Ulster Team Talk Thread III: That escalated quickly

    Here I fixed the ordering for you :D


This discussion has been closed.
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