Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Please note that it is not permitted to have referral links posted in your signature. Keep these links contained in the appropriate forum. Thank you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules
Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

Ionity charging network

24567…91

Comments

  • #32
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,107 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Its the coffee machine that makes the money.


  • #33
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Casati wrote: »
    I don’t agree they make the money in the shop, but they can’t afford to lose whatever profit they make on the forecourt.

    Eg A petrol station operator will need to cover their costs. Motorway stations always seem to be 2/3 cent dearer than the cheapest stations in a locality so this might mean their profit is 4 cent per litre rather than the 1 or 2 cent. 50 litres per fill-up means 2 euro in profit.

    A petrol or diesel fill will likely take 10% if the time of any fast ev charger so the station would need 10 times the profit per vehicle or 20 euro in profit per Ev to match the profit?

    The extra price at a service station covers the licensing cost for operating the station. They're not really making extra money on the fuel. They will however make much more money in the store. There is more profit in the black coffee they sell you than the 50l of fuel you pumped.


  • #34
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,068 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    https://electrek.co/2018/04/19/ionity-first-ultra-fast-electric-car-charging-station/


    I wonder are they battery packs in the background or are they just the inverters?


  • #35
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,318 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    KCross wrote: »
    https://electrek.co/2018/04/19/ionity-first-ultra-fast-electric-car-charging-station/


    I wonder are they battery packs in the background or are they just the inverters?
    Those look like the chargers.
    The same way that the tesla "superchargers" have a collection of white boxes, these are the actual "chargers".


  • #36
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    We won't be getting 6 chargers though , not according to topaz anyway, we'll get 4 per site.

    It will be pretty crap if the's load balancing, it would be pretty bad if a 100 Kw capable car was charging at 40-50 kw. No problem for current gen cars but still.


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,318 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Deleted User wrote: »
    We won't be getting 6 chargers though , not according to topaz anyway, we'll get 4 per site.

    It will be pretty crap if the's load balancing, it would be pretty bad if a 100 Kw capable car was charging at 40-50 kw. No problem for current gen cars but still.
    The Tesla chargers are capable of 140kW, but the chargers share 2 plugs. So at an 8 stall supercharger there's only 4 actual chargers.

    Has anyone any info from Ionity that confirms/denies the existence of a similar load balancing?

    Even 4 per site at 350kW each that's 1400kW peak and that's going to be a super draw on the network and have massive MIC charges.


  • #38
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,068 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    ELM327 wrote: »
    The Tesla chargers are capable of 140kW, but the chargers share 2 plugs. So at an 8 stall supercharger there's only 4 actual chargers.

    Has anyone any info from Ionity that confirms/denies the existence of a similar load balancing?

    Even 4 per site at 350kW each that's 1400kW peak and that's going to be a super draw on the network and have massive MIC charges.

    Thats why I asked about batteries in the background. I dont think any grid will be able to deliver 350kW per charger and then have a bank of 8 of those. Its not going to happen without load sharing and battery backup..... its how Tesla are doing it.

    In any case the initial Ionity rollout is all 175kW. There is no 350kW there. It just has the capability to be upgraded to 350kW.


  • #39
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    ELM327 wrote: »
    The Tesla chargers are capable of 140kW, but the chargers share 2 plugs. So at an 8 stall supercharger there's only 4 actual chargers.

    Has anyone any info from Ionity that confirms/denies the existence of a similar load balancing?

    Even 4 per site at 350kW each that's 1400kW peak and that's going to be a super draw on the network and have massive MIC charges.

    Wasn't tesla the company that also supplies batteries? If that ever becomes an issue, they can have a stationary 200 kWh pack at the site and use it to balance the load from the grid.


  • #40
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,068 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I see some interesting commentary on the 350kW headline that Ionity keep using....
    I am not sure why we call these 350 kW EVSE’s. Using the same kind of unobtainable ratings, the Tesla Superchargers could be called 500 volts * 370 amps = 185 kW. We don’t do that because the pack voltages are actually 400 volts. And the cars can actually pull 120 kW.

    On the 350 kW EVSE’s, the standard calls for 350 amps. The top end rate a Mission E with 800 volt charging, assuming typical voltage peak is 250 kW. The issue is then cell chemistry with degradation and pack heat management. Porsche has talked about 220 kW in the past when connected to 800 volt charging.

    Great progress if achievable without undue stress to the cells.

    It is about time we sort out a consistent way to rate these EVSE’s.


    I presume he is right with those figures. Is Ionity using a bit of marketing bluff here? Seems like it if a Mission E will max out at 250kW and thats from a super car with 800V packs (which us plebs wont see for many many years to come). Leaf's, Kona's etc will be on 400V for a while yet.

    Anything upto 100kW will be considered good at the lower end of the market.


  • #41
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 64,709 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    The chargers might deliver 350kW after a firmware upgrade, but as you say no car can take that for the foreseeable
    KCross wrote: »
    Anything upto 100kW will be considered good at the lower end of the market.

    2016 Ioniq can take 70kW. If any 2019 budget EV can take the full 150kW of the Ionity chargers, that would be wonderful, but I'd say that will be another year away.


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,068 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    unkel wrote: »
    The chargers might deliver 350kW after a firmware upgrade, but as you say no car can take that for the foreseeable

    Maybe. Doubling the power might require hardware too though. Adding battery packs, higher rated inverters etc. Maybe they have thought of all that up front and its just flip a switch to go from 175 to 350 but I doubt it somehow.

    unkel wrote: »
    2016 Ioniq can take 70kW. If any 2019 budget EV can take the full 150kW of the Ionity chargers, that would be wonderful, but I'd say that will be another year away.

    What budget EV do you think will take 150kW in another year?

    VW are quoting 30min charge times on their ID range for 2022 so they dont look like they are at 150kW and thats 2022 anyway. iPace, Kona and Niro are similar. I'd say 100kW will be the max they can manage (just an educated guess).

    150kW would be sweet though. Plenty for this island tbh. 37kWh's in 15mins.... that will take you almost anywhere in the country.


  • #43
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Im not sure what the difference is, I know it will charge a little quicker but lets say you have a 64kW Kona....you should be able to do 300km+

    So how many times in Ireland are you really going to need a fast charge from empty to full? So a 1 hour stop would not make a huge difference


  • #44
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    If you recharge when you're at 20km left of range on a Kona (5%) to 80% you'd need 48kWh.
    On a 50kW charger you'd need 1 hour, on a 80kW or more charge you'd need 36 mins, and would get you to 300km of range.
    One rapid charge gives you 670km of range (100% to 5% 385km, 80% to 5% 285km)

    I'm more interested in the fact that, charging faster increases the availability of the rapid chargers. The faster you charge, the more like the charger will be free when I arrive.


  • #45
    lafors
    Registered Users Posts: 4,316 ✭✭✭lafors


    Do we actually know any definite locations for Ireland rather than pin drops on a small map?


  • #46
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    lafors wrote: »
    Do we actually know any definite locations for Ireland rather than pin drops on a small map?

    Pins on maps....


  • #47
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Last time I checked they were still finalising location negotiations.

    4 sites of 4 chargers planned by next Summer, first to be commissioned by end of Summer or Summer.


    I'll see if I can pry any more details out of Them.


  • #48
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,318 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Last time I checked they were still finalising location negotiations.

    4 sites of 4 chargers planned by next Summer, first to be commissioned by end of Summer or Summer.


    I'll see if I can pry any more details out of Them.
    Ask them about the fact that Tesla recently joined them!


  • #49
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Be nice if Tesla went CCS too.


  • #50
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    There was always the rumour for Model 3 and we've already seen a Model S with the GB/T flap.


  • #51
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,318 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Be nice if Tesla went CCS too.
    They are a member of the CCS group and have now joined Ionity
    I fully expect model 3 to be sold in Europe at least with CCS compatibility.
    I know there currently are no adapters allowed but I can see Tesla going that route.

    Alternatively as above re GBT standard in China, but if a new chargeport needs to be fitted it couldnt be retrofitted to existing model S/X cars.


  • Advertisement
  • #52
    peposhi
    Registered Users Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭peposhi


    I am trying to get in touch with the person (team) that is responsible for the FCP rollout in Ireland and so far had no success whatsoever.
    I’ve already sent 2 emails on their IONITY.EU page and spoke meanwhile to the European customer service just to be told I have to contact them again via email.
    Does anyone know, someone who knows someone and etc. I’d really like to speak to the developing team...


  • #53
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    peposhi wrote: »
    I am trying to get in touch with the person (team) that is responsible for the FCP rollout in Ireland and so far had no success whatsoever.
    I’ve already sent 2 emails on their IONITY.EU page and spoke meanwhile to the European customer service just to be told I have to contact them again via email.
    Does anyone know, someone who knows someone and etc. I’d really like to speak to the developing team...

    Ionity are working with Topaz to install these chargers and hope to have the first up and running by the end of the Summer, I'll see if I can find out any more info.

    Each site will have 4 chargers and will be along motorway routes.

    By Summer 2019 they plan 4 sites, whether Ionity plan other non Topaz sites I don't know.

    The ESB are also upgrading existing ChaDeMo Topaz sites with the newer triple headed chargers, that's in progress as we speak.


  • #54
    bonky2018
    Registered Users Posts: 29 ✭bonky2018


    My brother liked electric in test drives and talking to friends who are owners
    However it wasnt to be he bought A 181 just end of April a Kia petrol 1000cc with turbo
    The new plan is to flip it in 3 years to EV when all the new chargers are in place and there are new 250k miles range cars and chargers not blocked up with IC cars


  • #55
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    bonky2018 wrote: »
    My brother liked electric in test drives and talking to friends who are owners
    However it wasnt to be he bought A 181 just end of April a Kia petrol 1000cc with turbo
    The new plan is to flip it in 3 years to EV when all the new chargers are in place and there are new 250k miles range cars and chargers not blocked up with IC cars

    It's going to be a long time before a car comes with 250,000 miles range on a full charge. He may be waiting for the nuclear reactor powered Leaf. ;-


  • #56
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 64,709 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    bonky2018 wrote: »
    My brother liked electric in test drives and talking to friends who are owners
    However it wasnt to be he bought A 181 just end of April a Kia petrol 1000cc with turbo
    The new plan is to flip it in 3 years to EV when all the new chargers are in place and there are new 250k miles range cars and chargers not blocked up with IC cars

    Looks like he made a mistake there. The first budget EV that can do well over 250 miles is out in the next few months.

    And fast chargers are rarely blocked up with ICE cars and slow chargers are pointless anyway for modern EVs. There are only plans for 9 Ionity chargers BTW.

    Go tell him the bad news :p


  • #57
    peposhi
    Registered Users Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭peposhi


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Ionity are working with Topaz to install these chargers and hope to have the first up and running by the end of the Summer, I'll see if I can find out any more info.

    Each site will have 4 chargers and will be along motorway routes.

    By Summer 2019 they plan 4 sites, whether Ionity plan other non Topaz sites I don't know.

    The ESB are also upgrading existing ChaDeMo Topaz sites with the newer triple headed chargers, that's in progress as we speak.

    Any luck Mad_Lad?
    I tried the CS and email again - not a dot back from them. Either they’re not interested or I’m contacting the wrong people...


  • #58
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    peposhi wrote: »
    Any luck Mad_Lad?
    I tried the CS and email again - not a dot back from them. Either they’re not interested or I’m contacting the wrong people...

    No unfortunately, I sent him another email, it's possible he missed it, I have over 10,000 unread emails in my work inbox ffs lol so I know how easy it is to miss an email and have to do real work at the same time yet be supposed to catch all the emails. !


  • #59
    karltimber
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 1,919 Mod ✭✭✭✭karltimber


    Deleted User wrote: »
    have to do real work at the same time yet be supposed to catch all the emails. !

    I'll give you the corporate answer - "you need to make time" :)


  • #60
    Jeditraining1
    Registered Users Posts: 190 ✭✭Jeditraining1


    unkel wrote: »
    I haven't seen any, but tbh, I don't really care. If I had to pay triple the normal full day time retail rates on the few occasions that I need a quick and reliable charge on my travels across the country with the full family on board, I'd be happy to pay it. And from what liamog states, the CirkleK business model is based on high margin shop offerings. Knowing my family, they'd all want a €3 hot chocolat or cappucino every time we charge, so I'll gladly contribute there too :D

    A triple domestic rate of €13c/kWh would be €40c/kWh. A charge to bring Ioniq from 15% to 85% would cost less than €8. And if the car really can take 100kW, then it would take just 12 minutes. Happy days.

    62kW is the max I have seen it take. Have a look at this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIe7SNyLAdQ Its a demo of it on a 150kW.


  • Advertisement
  • #61
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Planning permission for the first 6 Ionity sites is supposed to be submitted this week, that's all the info I got.


Advertisement