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Cycling>Electric bike.
Fluffy Cat 88 17:31 15-09-2016
(Mods please move this if its the wrong forum, thank you.)

I'm looking for a good sturdy electric bike, but from a bricks and mortar shop rather than online as I'd like to try it out and get user information face to face.

I'm in the Midlands so can travel to pretty much anywhere in Ireland. Good aftersales service would be essential (battery replacement, maintenance, servicing etc available if needed).

I suppose I need to be "fitted" with the right e-bike to suit my needs (long rural hilly journeys).

If someone could pm me or suggest shops that would be great.

Thanks for reading,

Fluffy Cat.
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Ray Palmer 20:24 15-09-2016 (1 Thanks)
http://www.greenaer.ie/

It really depends how much you want to spend along with how much maintenance.
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wench 20:33 15-09-2016 (1 Thanks)
The Dutch Bike Shop in Goatstown do some.
http://dutchbikeshop.ie/electric-bikes/
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omri 21:20 15-09-2016 (2 Thanks)
larryvsharry.com
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Mad_Lad 22:18 23-10-2016
OP did you ever get sorted ?

Some seriously good quality bikes here http://www.greenaer.ie/

From what I saw on this link these bikes are not nearly as good, http://dutchbikeshop.ie/electric-bikes/ any bike with a small front hub is going to be utter Sh**e on long steep hills.

The Bosch and Panasonic chain drive bikes are about the best you will buy , hub motors unless using a lot of power are not great on hills due to their single fixed gearing, with chain drives you use the bikes gearing for much better efficiency.

I have a 2013 Bosch Haibike EQ Trekking, the battery is still very good, I don't notice any loss of range, but it's not a daily commuter so it's had a pretty easy life.

You're not going to break speed records on these because they'r limited to 28 Mph and steep hills will see less speed , these bikes are designed to take the sting out of hills and they do so incredibly well.

The Newer Bosch drives , some of them at least have more torque.

My bike pulled me up to the top of Mount Leinster and some of this has 25% slopes !

You might even get a 2012 Haibike with Bosch drive on ebay for about 1500 Euro's these bikes are expensive but well worth the investment if you love cycling.

Image
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Turnipman 17:34 02-11-2016
I bought this online last week from the UK.

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It arrived today and, after giving it a 10 mile road test, it seems to be a decent enough basic bike for the rough, hilly country roads hereabouts. It's my second e-bike. The previous one LINK was grand for over 4 years, but the battery slowly died and on finding that a replacement battery would have cost me €600, I opted for a new bike instead!
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Mad_Lad 22:10 02-11-2016 (1 Thanks)
Is there any markings on the motor to identify it ?

Hubs are fine once you give them enough power , the geared hubs are the best and they usually have a clutch to disengage the motor which makes it a lot easier to pedal unassisted compared to the cheaper direct drive motors which experience motor drag due to the magnets and feels like you're pulling something behind.

Geared hubs are more efficient and offer more torque than direct drive motors. Direct drive motors have one advantage in that they're as simple as you get, the only moving part is the wheel itself.

The problem with hubs in general is that they get much less efficient on steep hills as the rpm reduces they consume much more power than a chain drive system because the chain drive can use the gears and if it starts to bog down you simply select a lower gear and the motor can gain more rpm and run in it's efficient zone again.

Either way hubs provide good bang for buck, once they're fed enough power. I ran 5 Kw through a geared hub and the acceleration was amazing. It had a top speed of 64 Kph at 60 volts. An 8T wind motor. Climbed hills with amazing speed , however hubs can't dissipate heat well, especially geared hubs if ran well over their rated power. But they pack amazing punch when fed real power.
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V-man 11:52 03-11-2016
Originally Posted by Mad_Lad:
Is there any markings on the motor to identify it ?
The problem with hubs in general is that they ...........
Are a pain when you have a flat tire.
Are a pain when developing cabling problems (specially font wheel).
Are a pain when rebuilding a wheel.

A proper Mid-drive is the way forward for most situations, Bosch/Yamaha are both reliable and smooth and most bicycle brands would use one of these two.

e-Bike Specialists in Dublin with a good selection and competitive prices.
http://www.greenaer.ie/
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Mad_Lad 13:16 03-11-2016
Yes Mid Drives are the way to go unfortunately the Bosch/Yamaha/Panasonic mid drives tend to be out of reach of a lot of people and that's why I said Hubs, only geared hubs provide good performance for the price, depending on the price of course and quality of components and the power.

I have puncture resistant tyres and haven't got a flat in years.

But yes, hubs can be a pain and the weight of a mid drive is batter balanced.

Mid drives are much more efficient for hills giving better battery range.

The likes of the Bosch e-bikes (like the one I have in the pic above) are expensive but if someone loves to get out on the bike but not a die hard cyclist they're absolutely well worth the investment. But a quality bike like the Haibikes etc are actually good to cycle unassisted, I can cycle mine for miles without motor power mainly on level ground then just turn on assistance as I need it and off again when I don't and this can add many miles to range, I do love to cycle, sadly I haven't got out this year much at all.

If someone has mainly level ground to cycle then I always recommend a light good quality road bike, the difference in a 300 Halfords bike to a 1000 Euro Trek for instance can be simply amazing.
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lil_kev 21:16 17-06-2018
I would like to know how Ebikes fuctions.

1. Can you use them like motorbikes or only as pedal assist?

2. Ebikes recommendation up to 2000 euro.

3. Is there any alternative to charge ebikes without charging them direct to socket like with pedaling?
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Mad_Lad 22:27 17-06-2018 (2 Thanks)
Originally Posted by lil_kev:
1. Can you use them like motorbikes or only as pedal assist?
You can use the non type approved ebikes with a throttle but beware the regulation police here on Boards will be around shortly to tell you how illegal it is.......They'll make sure they give you 10 pages of BS to make sure you're aware of the legalities of having a throttle or not.

Basically the jist of the legalities is this, throttle is not legal and power is limited to 250 watts, but it's not as simple as that because acceleration is also limited.

The likes of the Bosch Mid drive motors are 750 watts and get around this because 250 watts would not pull you out of bed and legislators are not technically mined , well, usually and fail to understand the logic behind lifting the 250 watt limit, it's 1000 watts in the U.S for instance.

Bosch over come this by limiting acceleration and applying power when you're in a lower gear peddling fast because the system will know that if you're peddling at xx cadence at xx Km'h then you must be going up a hill and will only then apply max power, very clever but it works brilliantly.

I have a 2013 Haibike EQ trekking, really great bike but I don't get time to ride it the last few years.

Originally Posted by lil_kev:
2. Ebikes recommendation up to 2000 euro.
Check out any ebike using Bosch or panasonic motors, mid drive motors that drive the crank, forget about hub motors because unless running higher power they are not that good on hills.

There are other ebikes that use crank powered systems but I'm most familiar with Bosch and having used it it's one I would seriously recommend if you like cycling.

Originally Posted by lil_kev:
3. Is there any alternative to charge ebikes without charging them direct to socket like with pedaling?
No, laws of physics, you'd never over come the resistance required to get a charge in the battery, basically the system would be running in reverse, acting like a generator and the resistance would be too great. You get nothing for nothing. Some hub motor bikes use the regen to slow the bike down saving the brakes but that's about it's only usefulness unless going down lots of mountains daily.

Here is a link to a site that you can get high quality ebike kits, the main Man that runs it is called Paul and he is from the U.K but living in China and he has contact with a lot of companies that make the motors he sells, he does not sell crap and makes a lot of his own battery packs and has great reputation over at endless-sphere which is a very good ebike forum.

Here's a link to his site , this link is a link to a couple of motors with different power ratings, I recommend the 750 watt motor kit, battery will cost more but they have so much these days compared to what I had to choose back in 2011 and batteries have improved a lot too.

https://em3ev.com/shop/?product_cat=middle-motor-kit

You can configure these kits to run without throttle that will only turn on when you pedal and the harder you pedal apply more power.

These kits are not illegal to buy or sell before anyone gets on their high horse here on boards especially the anti ebike crowd which are cycling snobs that hate any bike with a motor.

You can use these off road as you wish making them perfectly legal or configure to legal requirements, again, these kits in the link above are not illegal to buy and sell I guarantee it !

You'll need to be technically minded to put this stuff together or get someone who is.

You can always find 2nd hand bikes with Bosch system. You might pay 2 K for a 2nd hand one.

You can buy cheaper ebikes but if brand new and 2K or less beware.......there's a lot of junk out there.
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ED E 23:55 17-06-2018
For retailers talk to DLB in Dun Laoghaire. Small outfit but they really know their stuff and the shop cat is a real character.



The 250W limit isnt mindless, the US do lots of things that we choose not to with good reason.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...dutch-cyclists

MadLad will throw a hissy fit now in a sec but anything that doesnt fall under EN 15194 is not a pedelec, isnt exempted and thus is liable for very heavy penalties under the RTAs. Try getting insurance after a driving uninsured conviction.
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monument 01:32 18-06-2018
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Originally Posted by Mad_Lad:
regulation police here on Boards will be around shortly to tell you how illegal it is.......They'll make sure they give you 10 pages of BS to make sure you're aware of the legalities.... as that because acceleration is also limited.
The basics actually are:

1. It must be pedelec — you must generally be pedaling too and the motor must only assist you, not do all the work.

2. The motor must stop assisting you by 25km/h.

3. It must be only a 250 watt motor.

It’s simple, short, and not BS.

Why is it not BS? Anything that does not comply with the above three is m NOT strictly illegal, but are viewed as motorcycles and thus require: a motorcycle licence, payment and display of electric motorcycle motor tax, insurance, use of motorcycle helmets and all the other requirements of electric motorcycle use.
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Mad_Lad 19:06 18-06-2018
Who really cares, a question was asked. Not about legalities so get over it lads.

Sorry, the EN 15194 does not apply to retrofits.

And again, any kits sold are not illegal to buy because they can be used off road.

The kits can be made to all the specs required if needs be, run higher power but apply speed limit.

Bosch comply to regulations but run at around 750 watts at least for the 2012 times over the power limit, why ? because they limit speed and acceleration, does anyone care ? no because ebikes sold with 250 watts genuine max power would be useless.
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homer911 20:23 18-06-2018
Originally Posted by Mad_Lad:
Who really cares, a question was asked. Not about legalities so get over it lads.

Sorry, the EN 15194 does not apply to retrofits.

And again, any kits sold are not illegal to buy because they can be used off road.

The kits can be made to all the specs required if needs be, run higher power but apply speed limit.

Bosch comply to regulations but run at around 750 watts at least for the 2012 times over the power limit, why ? because they limit speed and acceleration, does anyone care ? no because ebikes sold with 250 watts genuine max power would be useless.
You have been making these assertions for a while - can you provide a link?
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