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Time to get rid of USC, Property tax

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    #62
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,073 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    The sum of all personal taxes, income tax, prsi and usc is very high. 50%+ and comes in at a very low income. Both are amongst the worst in the world.

    Let's check the data.

    https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/documents/statistics/income-distributors/income-tax-calculation.pdf

    2016 gross income = 94,565m

    tax due = 15.13%

    So now we know that the average effective income tax rate in Ireland is 15.13%


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    #63
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,073 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    Shai wrote: »
    Sorry, those figures surprise me. Would you mind putting some more context on those? How are earners paying 0% income tax? How are your parents paying 10%?

    Let's check the data:

    https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/documents/statistics/income-distributors/income-earners-tax.pdf

    2016 income tax

    2.4m income tax units

    875,000 exempt from income tax

    Over 35% of earners pay no income tax.


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    #64
    Shai
    Registered Users Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    Geuze wrote: »
    Let's check the data:

    https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/documents/statistics/income-distributors/income-earners-tax.pdf

    2016 income tax

    2.4m income tax units

    875,000 exempt from income tax

    Over 35% of earners pay no income tax.

    I am by no means disagreeing with you, I was merely hoping you might know how this came to be.


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    #65
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,666 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Tell you what I'd like to see.. The rebalancing of tax so that those unmarried or single aren't unfairly penalised for it in terms of the amounts they pay and the benefits they don't get.

    Also ridiculous that buying a decent property now requires 2 full time incomes


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    #66
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Great idea. Let's get rid of the one positive legacy the **** bags in Fine Gael have: the broadening of the tax base.


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    #67
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,714 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Wibbs wrote: »
    The "well you can always move house/downsize" is a silly argument that has little practical use unless you're actively looking to buy and where you buy isn't based on where your job/extended family/schools for your kids etc are.
    Also if you do move you are have to pay auctioneers fees , and stamp duty and possibly capital gains tax.


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    #68
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,666 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    troyzer wrote: »
    Great idea. Let's get rid of the one positive legacy the **** bags in Fine Gael have: the broadening of the tax base.

    To be fair, they've since taken so many back out of it again or reduced the rates that they effectively have narrowed it again


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    #69
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    troyzer wrote: »
    Great idea. Let's get rid of the one positive legacy the **** bags in Fine Gael have: the broadening of the tax base.

    To be fair, they've since taken so many back out of it again or reduced the rates that they effectively have narrowed it again

    I agree. I'm a lefty and I think backing down on water charges was ultimately stupid. They're going to back down on property taxes as well and they've made no secret of the fact that they want to cut USC.

    So they've ruined their own legacy.


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    #70
    Shai
    Registered Users Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    Tell you what I'd like to see.. The rebalancing of tax so that those unmarried or single aren't unfairly penalised for it in terms of the amounts they pay and the benefits they don't get.

    Are they? I thought there was only an income tax difference when only one person in a marriage works? I thought that when both people in a marriage were working each of them was pretty much taxed the same way as an unmarried person?


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    #71
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Shai wrote: »
    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    Tell you what I'd like to see.. The rebalancing of tax so that those unmarried or single aren't unfairly penalised for it in terms of the amounts they pay and the benefits they don't get.

    Are they? I thought there was only an income tax difference when only one person in a marriage works? I thought that when both people in a marriage were working each of them was pretty much taxed the same way as an unmarried person?

    Not quite. It's not just if only one person works, it's when one person makes a fair bit more money than the other.


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    #72
    Shai
    Registered Users Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    I just looked up the details. You are indeed quite correct.


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    #73
    Grueller
    Registered Users Posts: 5,100 ✭✭✭Grueller


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    People shouldn’t inherit anything. Work for your own wealth in an one generation.



    The real price for food is the market price. If the Irish farmers can’t compete let’s them rot. If they can’t manage steak at the price people want, import it.

    Absolutely. When farmers here are subject to the same welfare and traceability standards as the countries we import from, like Brazil, where foot and mouth is endemic for example or the USA where they use growth hormones banned in the EU and GM crops.


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    #74
    Geuze
    Registered Users Posts: 13,073 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    Shai wrote: »
    I am by no means disagreeing with you, I was merely hoping you might know how this came to be.

    You can earn a lot in Ireland before you enter the tax net.

    It used to be 20k, now 16,500, still higher than many countries.

    It's 18k/36k for people aged over 65.

    We have a very progressive income tax system.

    Very low direct taxes on low earners, but then it rises fast.

    Indeed, we have the most progressive income tax system in the OECD.


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    #75
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    troyzer wrote: »
    Not quite. It's not just if only one person works, it's when one person makes a fair bit more money than the other.

    Well it’s not that either, one making a fair bit more than the other makes no difference if both are in the higher tax bracket. If both of a couple are earning the fairly small amount that is required to pay the higher rate of tax then there is no advantage over a single person. If one doesn’t work or earns below the higher rate of tax and the other pays the higher Rae of tax there are some advantages and rightly so as a married couple are treated as a single unit for tax purposes (if you choose to be taxed in this way).


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    #76
    dr.fuzzenstein
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,635 ✭✭✭✭dr.fuzzenstein


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    People shouldn’t inherit anything. Work for your own wealth in an one generation.

    I don't think this is going to fly comradski.


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    #77
    nice_guy80
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭nice_guy80


    Reduce the USC

    Increase property taxes on larger and less energy efficient houses
    Especially in wealthier areas

    We should be encouraging people to build smaller houses with better energy performance

    People will also stop spending daft amounts of money on houses they really cannot afford


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    #78
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    nice_guy80 wrote: »
    Reduce the USC

    Increase property taxes on larger and less energy efficient houses
    Especially in wealthier areas

    We should be encouraging people to build smaller houses with better energy performance

    People will also stop spending daft amounts of money on houses they really cannot afford

    Live in a small house? No thanks, they are a waste of space compared to a bigger far more fictional house with all the space and rooms you want.


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